By: Randy Campbell (Old Dolfan)

GAME #5: OCT. 15, 1972 – SAN DIEGO at MIAMI

The Chargers franchise was the brain child of hotel heir Barron Hilton, the team’s original owner and son of Hilton Hotels founder Conrad Hilton, one of the richest men in the World.  In 1959 Hilton made the decision to place his team in the potentially lucrative Los Angeles market.  He signed former L. A. Rams head coach Sid Gillman, an offensive minded innovator and future Hall of Famer, to be his head coach.  Star players for the inaugural 1960 AFL season included quarterback Jack Kemp (from tiny Occidental College) and future Hall of Fame offensive tackle Ron Mix, from USC.  Unfortunately, only 17,724 persons paid to see the opening game against Dallas in the mammoth Los Angeles Coliseum (a game the Chargers won 21-20).  A few months later, when the Chargers clinched the AFC Western Division crown with a 41-33 win over the Denver Broncos, only 9,928 souls were present.  On January 1, 1961, the Chargers lost the very first AFL Champioship Game to George Blanda’s Houston Oilers 24-16.  Soon after the title game, Barron Hilton announced his team was leaving Los Angeles and moving to tiny Balboa Stadium in San Diego.  Famous San Diego sportswriter Jack Murphy convinced Hilton to make this move.  (When San Diego eventually built a new modern football stadium, they named it “Jack Murphy Stadium” in the sportwriter’s honor.)  A year later, the Chargers hosted the Oilers in the second AFL Championship Game.  29,000 fans in Balboa Stadium left disappointed as, once again, the Oilers prevailed, this time by a 10-3 score. After a poor 1962 season, the Chargers rebounded in 1963 with new quarterback Tobin Rote.  A 58-20 blowout win over Denver put San Diego in their third AFL title game in January of 1964.  Halfback Keith Lincoln recorded 349 yards of total offense pacing the Chargers to a 51-10 pounding of the Boston Patriots in the AFL Championship Game played in front of 30,000 delirious fans at Balboa Stadium.  That game produced the City of San Diego’s LAST professional sports title in any major sport!


In 1970 and 1971 the Chargers struggled.  The 1970 team went 5-6-3; the 1971 squad was 6-8. By ’72, San Diego boasted star players like future bob_griese_1972_10_15-207x300Hall of Famer David “Deacon” Jones, quarterback John Hadl and running back Mike Garrett.  Charger fans hoped 1972 would see their team return to the positive side of the ledger.  After losing their opener to the ’49ers, San Diego defeated Denver 37-14, tied the Raiders 17-17 and beat the Colts 23-20.  Nobody expected an easy win for the Dolphins.  But absolutely NO ONE could foresee the catastrophic injury that would impact Miami the day they played the Chargers in the historic Orange Bowl.  Fourteen plays into the game, Bob Griese rolled out to his left, searching for an open receiver.  Jim Kiick broke free as Griese’s pass headed downfield.  Most eyes followed the ball.  Behind the play, “Deacon” Jones and Ron East simultaneously crushed Griese.  “I didn’t need to see the 140stretcher to know I was going out,” said the Dolphin’s All-Pro quarterback.  The diagnosis was a dislocated right ankle and a broken bone in the same ankle.  GRIESE WAS DONE for the rest of the regular season, at a minimum!One TV network commentator said, “Well there goes the Perfect Season now!  There’s no way Miami goes undefeated without Bob Griese!”

Back-up quarterback Earl Morrall trotted onto the field.  Morrall and Don Shula had been through this before.  Back in 1968, Shula chose Morrall to replace the injured John Unitas as the Colts starting quarterback.  All Morrall did was win the NFL’s Most Valuable Player award as he guided Baltimore to a date with destiny in Super Bowl III versus the underdog Jets.


But this situation was different.  From 1969 through early 1972 Morrall played sparingly.  In April of ’72, Morrall was released by Baltimore.  Shula picked-up Morrall for the $125 waiver wire price in one of the greatest bargains in NFL history!Could the 38 year old crew cut Morrall shake-off the rust and still produce at the highest level?  On his first drive Morrall guided Miami into San Diego territory.  Yepremian’s 37-yard field goal gave the ‘Fins a 3-0 lead.  San Diego’s Dennis Partee countered with a field goal, tying the game 3-3.


Early in the second quarter safety Dick Anderson grabbed a fumble by the Charger’s Mike Garrett and scampered 35 yards for the go-ahead touchdown.  Later in the quarter, fifth defensive back Lloyd Mumphord intercepted a John Hadl pass, returning it to the San Diego 34.  Two Larry earl-morrall-240x300Csonka runs produced 14 yards. After a short run by Jim Kiick, Morrall threw a perfect pass to reliable Howard Twilley, good for an 18-yard touchdown.  It was 17-3 Miami at halftime.  Shula warned his players NOT to ease-off the gas pedal in the second half.  “We’ve got a point to prove and we’re going to prove it,” said the Don of Miami.  Methodically, Earl Morrall took the Dolphins on a 65-yard touchdown drive to start the third quarter.  A 23-yard bullseye to Twilley got Miami into San Diego territory.  The drive concluded when Morrall arched a gorgeous 19-yard touchdown strike to Paul Warfield.  Yepremian’s PAT gave the inspired Dolphins an insurmountable 24-3 lead.  A late fourth quarter Charger’s score made the final 24-10, Miami.  But the game was not that close.  On the day, Miami’s “No Name Defense” limited Hadl to just 110 yards passing.  It would be his lowest yardage total for any game the entire season!  More importantly, Earl Morrall had steadied the ship.  His near-perfect 8 for 10 passing effort was good for two touchdowns and no interceptions.  He walked off the Orange Bowl field with the confident smile of a winner.


Appreciative Dolphin fans, and Dolphin players, roared their approval as Earl Morrall strode into the Dolphins’ locker room, his arms raised in victory!  Next up: a date with the Buffalo Bills in what would prove to be the most bizarre game of the season.


The 1972 Dolphins, minus Bob Griese, were now 5-0.

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  1. jetsssuck says:

    Earl Morrall was picked up off of waivers for 100 bucks not 125.

  2. jetsssuck says:

    any of you northerners getting any of Florida vegetables or fruits. It’s our beginning of the season for strawberries. Check these prices Strawberries for 1lb package for 99cents,Cantaloupes 99cents each,pineapples 1.29, Florida oranges 4lbs for 1.29 and red apples for 39cents lb.

  3. olddolphan says:

    My notes said Miami paid a $125 waiver fee for Morrall. But, either way, the Dolphins got the bargain of the decade! Hope all you folks like this amazing episode.
    I’ve been told that the greatest team of all time was the ’49ers of the ’80’s. Another said Staubach’s Cowboys while still another said Bradshaw’s Steelers were the best. To all those folks I say “When YOUR team runs the table and starts a back up quarterback in 11 games, please let me know. Until then, the ’72 Dolphins are the greatest team in NFL history!!!”

  4. Try Pod says:

    Thanks for the writes, OD.
    I’ve said it before, but I really appreciate people taking time from their lives to create these articles for us to read. They are time-consuming, and most here seem to be conscientious about their works, so doing the fact checking and research.. I am a fan of you guys- all of you.

  5. jetsssuck says:

    Miami Dolphins signed Dwayne ‘The Rock’ Johnson.


  6. The Flying Pig says:

    Great piece OD

    Poor Griese
    I hope the injury doesn’t hurt our chances to go undefeated…


  7. The Flying Pig says:

  8. The Flying Pig says:

    @TheFlyingPig44: In case you missed it yesterday,
    Here is an Alien’s scouting report of Todd Gurley

    Yep, an alien…


  9. jetsssuck says:

    Miami Dolphins: The Dolphins clearing space over the last few days had led to speculation that the team is preparing to make a splash in free agency. The team has approximately $10 million of cap space after putting a $7.071 million transition tag on tight end Charles Clay. More cap room can be easily created by releasing additional players.

    The same structure the Dolphins adopted when the team was aggressive during free agency in 2013 could be used with Suh. Those deals contained modest signing bonuses and salary guarantees to keep the first year cap number low. The base salaries in the first two years of these deals were fully guaranteed at signing. The second year cap number typically was more than twice as much as in the first year.

    Mike Wallace, who signed a five-year, $60 million deal, had the most extreme jump. His cap number went from $3.25 million in 2013 to $17.25 million in 2014. A similar type of increase in first and second cap numbers might be necessary with Suh. Some of the deals had conditional third-year base salary guarantees that were player friendly. For example, $3 million of Dannell Ellerbe’s 2015 base salary became fully guaranteed on the fifth day of the 2014 league year, which was last March 15. The Dolphins or any other team where there isn’t a state income tax could try to sell Suh on the concept that the overall dollars in the deal don’t have to equal what they would elsewhere. For instance, a six-year contract with $94.3 million over six years and $50.85 million in the first three years is equivalent to a six-year, $102 million deal with $55 million over the first three years in Detroit, after taxes.

  10. son of a son of a shula says:

    Wednesday, Dolphins win again!

  11. son of a son of a shula says:

    My daddy left home when I was three
    And he didn’t leave much to ma and me
    Just this old guitar and an empty bottle of booze.
    Now, I don’t blame him cause he run and hid
    But the meanest thing that he ever did
    Was before he left, he went and named me “Suh.”

  12. The Flying Pig says:

    @TheFlyingPig44: Brady’s reaction to rumors Dolphins are candidates to acquire Suh http://t.co/S0efXvT7EP

    • son of a son of a shula says:


    • son of a son of a shula says:

    • Mike E. says:

      Kraft will be on the phone with Goodell 2 seconds after we got Suh, and the dialogue would go something like this . . . .

      KRAFT: Uh, Hi Roger, by now I’m sure you’ve heard that the Miami Dolphins just signed Suh, right?

      GOODELL: Yes Bob, I did. Just came through.

      KRAFT: Just tell me I have nothing to worry about Roger, I want to HEAR that!

      GOODELL: No worries Bob. Really. Your boys can hold that barbarian all day long like you do with that other pest, Wake. If That animal even “squeaks” about anything I’ll suspend him for his poor behavior. Don’t you worry Bob, he won’t get near our Tommy, you have my word on that!

  13. Ken says:

    F’n Bills get LeSean McCoy. 3rd place again. SMMFH

  14. Ken says:

    I don’t see how we can sign Suh. He will cost close to 20 million a season. We don’t have that cap space without gutting our roster.

    • D says:

      Think McCoy forces our hang to make room? J?K but actually im not so sure McCoy is to be as feared as he once was. Dont get me wrong i think he is still good RB, but Spiller was too, at this point in his career i think it would be like facing Spiller so no worse off than before.

    • The Flying Pig says:

      We have the cap room Ken

      Stop thinking that way

      We are actually going to be well under the cap in 2016

      Everyone is reporting we are serious players for Suh

      And we can sign Suh without affecting the ability to sign Tanny long term

      All of the sudden this Suh thing got very serious

  15. D says:

    Damn, AJ Francis having a twitter spat with someone lol. When will these guys learn.

  16. jetsssuck says:

    what would be fun to watch twice a year is suh vs our former mr nfl dirtiest player.

  17. Ken says:

    The FA I most want us to sign who I think will have a bigger impact than Suh is Iupati

  18. Mike E. says:


    I’d actually rather the Bills have McCoy than Alonso. McCoy wasn’t nuthin’ last season. He couldn’t create any space for himself. I had him in FF, and I watched him a lot. Not sure why, but he was very pedestrian last season.

    • dbolt48 says:

      Essentially they are adding McCoy and probably David Harris. I agree with you, McCoy is less of a concern to me than a healthy Alonso.

  19. Ken says:

    McCoy is light years better than Spiller

    • Mike E. says:

      He WAS, but I’m telling you, last year he was anything but special, and I watched a lot of his games. They didn’t trade him for an injured LB because he’s the best RB in the NFL.

    • D says:

      Not any more man, you could see it last year he just didnt have it. I dont doubt he is still an elite back, but he isnt anything near like he was in 2013.

    • The Flying Pig says:

      He showed signs of decline last year

      Heading in the wrong side of 40

      And Ryan isn’t exactly a great offensive mind

      I don’t think either team got better or worse

      It was a salary purge by the Eagles
      And Alonso doesn’t for Rex scheme I guess

  20. son of a son of a shula says:

    We can sign Suh most of the money he’ll get this year will be signing bonus not Cap money, then give another wad of the guaranteed next year when we have a lot of cap space.

    Get Suh – Get Playoffs
    That’s the way I see it.

  21. The Flying Pig says:

    Espn Headline

    Last night Roger Goodell was “pork chopped” in his sleep.

    In other news Tom Brady wet himself

  22. son of a son of a shula says:

    Suh will smash Richie’s Ferrari oh wait Richie does that all by himself

  23. D says:

    I think its close, i mean McCoy is still a very special RB, elite even if its in decline, but i think Mike is right, Alonso probably woulda affect us more.

  24. The Flying Pig says:

    The a Eagles were actually about to cut McCoy to save cap room

    But they got something out of it

    Chip Kelly seems obsessed with former ducks

  25. dbolt48 says:

    I’m still not buying Suh to Miami. Though the immense cap space in 2016 & 2017 make it feasible though. That space makes it feasible to land him, Franklin, MLB, and good DB.

  26. son of a son of a shula says:

    To put this in “Absolute Perfection” terms – Suh would be our modern day Manny Fernandez. Y’all unnerstan me now?

  27. D says:

    I was one of the first to say Suh was a real possibility, i even crunched some numbers months ago and came up with a way we could do it. It does cripple our FA moves, pretty much would be one and done, or one and a decent second, like we MAY be able to squeeze in a OG like Boling, but it would be pretty tight. It would also really depend on if they can get a couple people Wake being the big one, to renegotiate. I think if they told him they were trying to add Suh he may would. Id be ok if out FA was Suh, and Boling. Id like to add a vet DB, or LB, but if we got those two positions filled with those guys we would be successful. I still find Knighton to be a more cost effective option, but its not about “is it doable, because it is, its do you put all your eggs in one basket.

  28. Mike E. says:

    To me, getting Suh would definitely generate a lot of interest and excitement. It’s definitely not something we have to do, but it would be pretty wild if we did.

    • D says:

      I agree, i think its an awesome idea, and immediately i think our defense goes from meh to very strong, but we would still have a lot of holes to fill and it would be come getting cant misses in draft to make sure we filled them. Im good with it either way, as everything could work out in either direction, but its just something they will and probably already have mulled over. Im just going to trust them to make the right decision.

  29. D says:

    dbolt48 says:
    March 4, 2015 at 9:50 am
    I’m still not buying Suh to Miami. Though the immense cap space in 2016 & 2017 make it feasible though. That space makes it feasible to land him, Franklin, MLB, and good DB.
    That space though is not counting Pouncey, or Clay, or a extension on Tanny. Though it does include Wheeler and Ellerbe, who both would likely be cut.

    • son of a son of a shula says:

      Tannehill can get done next year easily enough. We have the option on him for next year already.

    • dbolt48 says:

      Nope already got that, but with there newer contracts you can construct them around Suh’s. Also in a year or two Both Grimes and Wake will be asked to restructure or be shown walking slips. It’s just that balancing act.

      • D says:

        Yeah but losing Grimes at CB would make us weak in coverage so having Suh gets almost nullified. You have to keep those two things balanced to have a strong defense. Having Suh would probably give us the latitude to be “adequate” in pass coverage and get by, but honestly right now we are barely adeqaute now WITH Grimes.

      • dbolt48 says:

        Not really what I’m saying about Grimes. I think he’s gone in another year or two. His play slipped in the second half and he will be in his mid 30’s. Same with Wake. Suh would be a proper investment for this defense as those two faze out. Now I could see them going after a young corner in FA this year also. I know what you’re getting at, but we have to hope Taylor will stay healthy and Davis can get healthy etc. We can’t hope that players in their mid 30’s can hold the fort for this team. I think you know what I’m getting at.

  30. son of a son of a shula says:

    Adding Suh is more than just adding a FA piece, its a HUGE statement, it changes the entire complexion of the D and team. We would have the most feared defenders and a giant marquee player, we’d be making noise boys.

  31. Try Pod says:

    Today’s game is offense-centric. To spend the kind of money it is going to take to get one player on the defensive side of the ball seems irresponsible to me, and would hamstring the team for 5+ years. And I really like Suh. But watch what Houston hours through.

    • Try Pod says:


    • The Flying Pig says:

      You can afford a few high priced players

      It’s less important what position they play

      The issue is are they elite

      If you are going to pay a guy elite money
      He needs to be elite

      And Suh is

      Wallace is not

      Suh will shape the D of whichever team he goes to

      Great QB
      Protect the QB
      Great pass rush

      That is what it takes to succeed
      And Suh is among the best at his position

      • Try Pod says:

        Not on the defensive side of the ball-he would be the highest paid player. It would be the wrong use of the cap space.

  32. son of a son of a shula says:

    D says:
    March 4, 2015 at 9:59 am (Edit)
    Yeah at 15mil against the cap.

    But it wouldn’t be a hit like that with an extension. He’d bet a whole new deal that would be a lot more cap-friendly than that.

    • D says:

      Its going to about that much with an extension… you might be + or minus but its going to be pretty close to that much, especially if they are going for the contract they are rumored to be going for, 106 for 6 year, and 3rd year option for team. That means they are going to try to frontload that contract, meaning its actually more likely north of 15mil the first year.

  33. D says:

    Ya need to add about 30mil to the cap numbers next year and thats without Suh’s 17, so about 47mil to the 102mil we have on the books. That puts at about 149mil which would be backs against the wall, and we’d have to cut someone or clear cap space JUST to sign the draft class. Again im not saying it isnt doable, but the freedom to do it isnt as much as you guys think. Im actually somewhat on the side of getting him, we just will have to walk a hard line as far as the contract and be prepared to make some sacrifices down the line, like we might would have to cut Wake next year and draft a replacement.

  34. Ken says:

    1,300 yards rushing by McCoy last year plus he is an excellent receiver. Don’t know much but that is pretty special talent.

  35. The Flying Pig says:

    Suh dance

    • Try Pod says:

      Again, I like him, but the league penalizes defense and promotes offense. Spend more on offense than defense. When the rules start to favor defense (if ever), then get that player.

    • son of a son of a shula says:


  36. The Flying Pig says:


    To me a wining model in this cap environment would be to spend big $ on your qb, LT and pass rush

    But you have to draft skill positions well as well as other positions on d

    But I do think spending on pass rush is a good idea and a winning formula

    • Try Pod says:

      I understand you think that, I just don’t think recent history will support your theory/premise.

      • Try Pod says:

        That being a contract of 100mil+ on the defensive side of the ball= playoff success. And I’m not even talking about his personality, and the likelihood he’ll be suspended at different times during his contract period.

  37. The Flying Pig says:

    @flasportsbuzz: Cap guru Joel Corry notes if Suh signs 6 yr,$102 M deal,he gets $58.99 million from Fins (no state tax),compared with $51.1 M from Raiders.

  38. son of a son of a shula says:

    But ya ought to thank me, before I die,
    For the gravel in ya guts and the spit in ya eye
    Cause I’m the son-of-a-bitch that named you “Suh.'”

  39. Mike E. says:


    I understand what you’re saying. Truth is, you need to have your QB in place, and I think we have that. We can get some WR talent in this draft, and provided we didn’t get rid of Wallace, we will have talent on the offensive side of the ball too. I do understand though at some point Tannehill will need to get paid, and when that happens, we will have too much money tied up into 2 players. That I agree on, and it will prevent us from keeping or obtaining other good players.

  40. The Flying Pig says:

    Rumor has it McCoy is upset about trade to buffalo…lol

  41. D says:

    D says:
    March 4, 2015 at 10:27 am
    The Flying Pig says:
    March 4, 2015 at 10:11 am
    How signing Suh works for us cap wise


    Article is right in line with my thoughts, and infact its almsot exactly what i posted like 2 months ago when we first started talking about it.

  42. dbolt48 says:

    I agree with you in regards to Spiller in Kelly’s system. Definitely not a knock against shady as he took advantage of what he was given. Just like Lamar Miller took advantage of the read option last year. Nothing wrong with that.

  43. Ken says:

    If we are to spend money in FA go get Iupati. That will have a bigger impact than signing Suh

    • The Flying Pig says:

      He is a good player

      But Suh is deifinately likely to make a bigger impact wherever he goes

      He is probably one of the top 2 defensive players in the league

      Him and Watt IMO

  44. son of a son of a shula says:

    The most important factor in signing Suh is to have Tannehill continue to progress and instead of marginally progress this year we need a real big step from him. The type of step that puts him in the conversation about the better QB’s in the league, the type of step that puts Wins on the board, the type of step that ensures we have our guy for the next many years.

  45. The Flying Pig says:

    D’s Suh dance

  46. son of a son of a shula says:

    If you don’t want Suh you love 8-8, lol jbb

  47. The Flying Pig says:

    Ken Hulk dance

  48. D says:

    I will have to agree with Ken, getting an OG IS probably the most important position fill in FA. I think we can manage both, again, with the correct structuring of the contract, etc. Will take some strong magic by the cap witch, and probably means i get my wish and we cut Wallace 🙂

  49. The Flying Pig says:

    Mike E Suh Dance

  50. Mike E. says:

    We’ll get Suh, and we’ll cut Wallace, and we’ll lose all our games 6-3. lol

  51. D says:

    The other thought with us taking Suh is, better to be with him than see him lined up for the Jets. LOL

  52. Try Pod says:

    I guess you get what I am saying-hell, I’m not even sure anymore. You can get a few solid players on defense for the price it is going to cost to get one. I just don’t think it pays to tie that much up on one player who is not the qb. If you develop that player, then maybe, but I am dubious to paying a fa that kinda money. I realize those are different points, but it hours into my thinking on this.

  53. D says:

    Tim’s Suh dance

  54. Silly Tim says:

    OD, it’s hard to argue against the 1972 Dolphins as the best team ever. The 1984 49ers were the best team I ever saw as an adult. I was too young to really get what the 1972 Dolphins were all about.

  55. Silly Tim says:

    LOL @ all the Suh dances.

  56. The Flying Pig says:

    Trypod’s Suh Dance

  57. Mike E. says:

    Tom Brady’s Dolphins DON’T sign Suh dance

  58. D says:

    Since Don shula apparently has never dances, therefore the internets has none… this is Son’s dance.

  59. CavalierKong says:

    Suh dances

  60. Silly Tim says:

    FFR getting his groove on.

  61. D says:

    Steelers trying to get Polamalu to retire so they dont have to cut him.

  62. D says:

    Ian Wharton now saying the Suh deal is going to be 6years 110-115mil at least half guaranteed.

  63. D says:

    ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 17m17 minutes ago

    Agent Kennard McGuire tells PFT that he has asked the Texans to cut WR Andre Johnson. McGuire has not and will not try to seek a trade.

  64. Mike E. says:

    LMAO @ the FFR dance! Bitch was like “One minute I was twirling my hair like crazy, and the next I just took off from the stage and landed on my head”. “Not sure, but I think I’m smarter now”.

  65. The Flying Pig says:

  66. Try Pod says:

    Of the 10 highest paid defensive players in the NFL last year (Suh was #8), only one has played in the Superbowl, and he was a db (Richard Sherman).

  67. Silly Tim says:

    Here’s Tom Brady trying to look like a tennis coach.

  68. Al in MIA says:

    So what did i miss in the last 15-17 hours…the Fins actually going to sign Suh or are we being used as leverage for a new deal in Detroit?

  69. The Flying Pig says:

    Here is Tom Brady watching Gronk take off his shirt

  70. Al in MIA says:

    My only concern with Suh in a Fins uni is that the NFL will be seeking to suspend him routinely 😦

  71. Al in MIA says:

    Suh contemplating TBrady
    The mind of Ndamukong Suh

  72. Al in MIA says:

    Guys stop with the Jenner pics, i’m in tears here at my desk LOLOLOL

  73. Ken says:

    If we sign Suh we are going to be eating a huge portion of our cap for years to come and we still need to fix the OL and WR. Detroit probably had the best DL in the league last year and couldn’t win a playoff game.

  74. Ken says:

    Don’t get me wrong. I like Suh a lot. He is a great player. I will cheer for him if we sign him but I don’t think it is the best move for us. Detroit with Suh has not won a playoff game.

  75. D says:

    Bleacher Report ‏@BleacherReport 1h1 hour ago

    VIDEO: Finishing a father’s dream, Manute Bol’s son could be a 7’4” Kevin Durant http://ble.ac/1GSmHu7
    This Kid is friggin 15 years old and is already 6’10

    • Al in MIA says:

      Haven’t seen the video yet but hopefully he has a better shot than Bol lol.

    • Al in MIA says:

      One of my HS moments was sitting behind the Sixers bench in an overtime game and telling Bol to shut it that his team sucked because they couldn’t put away a crappy Miami team (cause he kept going “yessssss!” when his team rebounded). He gave me the ‘fuck you’ look lol.

  76. Al in MIA says:


    Cap games are fun exercises ($1 mill cap hit one year, 20 the next lol).

    The real hurdle for Miami is stacking Suh’s yearly hit with Ryan Tannehill’s future deal.

    Besides, the total money being reported is worthless as we all know the only $ that we care about is guaranteed money.

    The biggest problem will be that fucking contract TB gave McCoy which serves as the benchmark I guess ($51 mill guaranteed in that deal).

    Prior to that contract, DT’s like Ngata and Wilfork only got 25-27 mill in guaranteed money in their best playing contracts.

    The Bills Dareus is getting about 21 mill in guaranteed money on his current deal.

    McCoy is the only outlier but I’m pretty sure Suh’s agent going to project his client’s deal based on that.

    • Silly Tim says:

      I believe they’re looking at J.J. Watt’s contract.

    • stangerx says:

      “The real hurdle for Miami is stacking Suh’s yearly hit with Ryan Tannehill’s future deal.”

      Absolutely Al — that is the crux of it. For sure we can sign both and have the cap friendly first years in both, but that just delays the hit. Would hate to be in cap hell three years from now.

      • Silly Tim says:

        If you sign Suh and give Tanny his future deal, you better be a good team and make it to a championship game if not a super bowl. Can’t just be okay.

      • stangerx says:

        Completely agree Tim. Don’t think we are ready for that kinda signing. Might be different if we didn’t have Tanny’s salary zooming up in the picture.

  77. Ken says:


    My understanding is Suh is looking at JJ Watt’s deal as the benchmark. That is 6 years 100 million. Too much imo for a player who is not a QB. It’s a QB league and you have to pay the QB and protect the QB. I just don’t see that kind of investment as the piece that gets you to the next level.

  78. Ken says:

    Going to grab some lunch BBL.

  79. Al in MIA says:

    JJ Watt’s deal is the same as McCoy’s anyway (51 guaranteed).

  80. D says:

    Nate Washington is being rumored to be one of our targets for FA, a little older but probably comes on the cheaps. Dunno, he’s been pretty solid performer, but id rather bring in a draft pick to replace Hartline than another vet.

  81. jahndoh says:

    Ken says:
    March 4, 2015 at 9:36 am
    F’n Bills get LeSean McCoy. 3rd place again. SMMFH
    I don’t know if you’re saying they’re 3rd place or being a defeatist and saying we’re 3rd place. McCoy did little last year, he’s getting up there in years and they’re losing Spiller, I think they went backwards at running back. Bills with McCoy (the current one, not the younger one that everyone remembers) don’t scare anyone.

    • drg says:

      Agreed, this trade doesn’t scare me in the least. Ryan’s defense and competent play at QB worries me more.

      • jahndoh says:

        Agreed on both of those counts as well. The Bills will contend in this division (IMHO) but not because of McCoy.

  82. Al in MIA says:

    Actually, I’m looking at McCoy & Watt’s deals. McCoy gets more $ in his first two years (35 mill over first 2 seasons) than Watts who gets $26.5 over first two seasons.

    Neither is guaranteed anything north of $30-35 mill meaning if they are cut after 2015 season, they lose about 10-20 mill in so called guaranteed money which isn’t guaranteed lol.

    • jahndoh says:

      I do not understand the last paragraph at all. Guaranteed is guaranteed. Are you saying that some of the guarantee doesn’t trigger until they make the roster in 2016 (or some similar trigger criteria)??? If so than that makes sense, but I would point out that money isn’t guaranteed until that triggering event.

      I haven’t looked at the contracts, probably won’t since neither have anything to do with the fins to be honest, so this is just in response to your post fwiw.

  83. Al in MIA says:

    Sproles kinda stole McCoy’s thunder and it seems for whatever reason Chip used McCoy to set up Sproles. Anyway, I think Ryan prefers a power back and the Bills see that there will be guys like Corey Grant in the draft to have as a complementary speed back.

    • jahndoh says:

      Sproles also not as good as Spiller. That’s the deal here. Read my post above. Sproles isn’t the sole reason his production fell off a cliff, he had the same amount of carries year over year but 300 less yards, 1 yard per carry less in average, and nearly half the TDs. His receiving dropped off a cliff, which SOME of that can be attributed to Sproles, but man, the bells marking the traditional RB career dropoff are ringing really loudly.

      • jahndoh says:

        This should say “read my post below” as the above one is a totally different topic. LOL

  84. Silly Tim says:

    Jahn, I agree McCoy is getting up there in years in the league but he did rush for over 1,300 yards last year. His receiving yards 37-155 were horrible though. I wouldn’t trade for a RB entering his 7th season.

    • jahndoh says:

      Me neither. Look at his attempts per game. Same year over year. Yet his average went down almost a full yard, his yards per game went down by 18 his total yardage went down by 300 yards, his receiving production fell off a cliff.

      He’s not the same guy. Pointing out 1300 yards in a vaccum is all you could do to compliment the guy because when you hold it up to what he’d done in the past and you remember that the same coach who saw him in his heyday traded him for a talented but oft injured LB, well, the writing’s on the wall. I would rather have Spiller than McCoy straight up in 2015. That trade doesn’t scare me at all. Rex Ryan things he can revive RB careers after they start to go downhill, but did Chris Johnson scare anyone last year?

  85. D says:

    Bills just got Cassel from Vikes lol…damn they are desperate not to play Manuel

  86. jahndoh says:

    I think most of you are getting played on the Suh thing. I will gladly endured piggy’s squealing if I’m wrong, but I just don’t see how it works.

    Ryan Tannehill is going to get paid. They’ll have to defer a bunch of Suh’s cap hit into 2016 to make it fit under the current cap, and that’s when they’ll need money for Tannehill’s contract. Waiting to resign Tannehill is a fools errand. If you honestly believe his career arc is going to fall off a cliff in the next 2 years I have some oceanfront property in Arizona for you. He’s only going to get more expensive.

    The current fins ALREADY spend more money on Defense than they do on offense. Adding Suh would make that number really lopsided. Does Suh make us the top defense in the league? Did he do that for Detroit? Does he make us a playoff team? Did he do that for detroit?

    Tannehill’s contract is what we’re clearing money for, not Suh’s. You’re all getting played and I’m the guy who will listen to the fallout when Suh doesn’t get signed. So, I’m allowed to point it out.

    If I’m wrong, I’ll root for him 100%, and enduring the squealing. But I don’t see how it works when this team has so many other holes to fill and those holes only get bigger in years 2 and 3 of a hypothetical Suh contract when his cap hit will be the greatest.

  87. D says:

    Bill traded a 5th and a 7th to Vikes for Cassell.

  88. Silly Tim says:

    This Jahn’s dance when we don’t sign Suh,

    • jahndoh says:

      LOL…won’t celebrate it, I don’t even say “I told you so” very often. I just don’t see it happening, but I do see us as fans getting burned every offseason when the media stirs our hopes and it doesn’t play out.

  89. wyoming85 says:

    Somebody post something so that guy will get off my screen!

  90. drg says:

    I’m in the buzzkill crowd regarding Suh as well. Great player, but since when has making a splash in FA turned a team into a consistent playoff contender? Realistically, it’s taking a shot at the SB for the next two years. Sorry, I just don’t see it. It would get me more excited for our chances next season I guess.

    Recently read an article on how Baltimore maintains their depth and seems to find good young players to fill in holes of departed vets. Detailed how they make most of their trades/FA moves based on compensatory picks. They understand the draft is a crapshoot, but give yourself enough chances and you will hit on enough to fill out the roster with quality starters and backups. There’s a reason they are in the mix every year and will continue to do so even without an elite QB.

  91. wyoming85 says:


  92. Al in MIA says:


    “Are you saying that some of the guarantee doesn’t trigger until they make the roster in 2016 (or some similar trigger criteria)??? If so than that makes sense, but I would point out that money isn’t guaranteed until that triggering event.”

    Yes. For quick analysis on guaranteed money, I just view what OverTheCap or Spotrac shows at the header for guarantees.

    But when I glance at the allocation of money and specifically the schedule of dead money in the progression of years, I get a better idea of guarantees.

    In Watt’s case, his 2016 & 2017 base is guaranteed on the first day of the 2016 NFL calendar year (base = $10.5 mill each of those years). Spotrac’s data shows roughly $31 mill guaranteed at signing ($10 mill signing bonus; $10 mill roster bonus to be applied in 2015 cap year, & base salaries in 2014/15 of $900k & $10 mill respectively.

    Spotrac shows $6 mill dead money hit for Watt for 2016 cap year (OverTheCap showing same).

    McCoy’s contract outlay shows a $21.3 mill allocation for 2014, $14.6 mill for 2015, and 96% of his 2017 money guaranteed by 3rd day of 2016 NFL calendar year. There’s also a roster bonus of $6.5 mill allocated for 2016 on top of a base salary of $6 mill scheduled for that season (guaranteed on 3rd day of 2016 calendar year.).

    McCoy’s dead money for 2016? $1.5 mill.

    • jahndoh says:

      I’m not sure I have that much mental power to apply to non-fins contracts, but your “yes.” helps a lot and I’ll take the word on the rest. Those clauses where guys are guaranteed their base salary on day 1 of the new league year (or whatever triggering criteria they use) are tantamount to injury guarantees. The team still has an out if they want to cut the player in the offseason, but if not they’re guaranteeing his next years’ salary against injury.

      I do enjoy how creative these things can get. 9 times out of 10, it’s about how the agent presents/sells the contract to the player. Because most players don’t have a prayer of understanding those contracts…

  93. Ken says:

    I think there are a lot of people underestimating exactly how good McCoy is and how overestimating how good Spiller is. McCoy is a legit feature back while Spiller has never been able to be the featured back.

    • jahndoh says:

      That’s why McCoy split time with Sproles last season? Doesn’t compute, and honestly, I don’t think “feature back” matters much anymore. Spiller could have been a feature back, but Fred Jackson was not to be denied. McCoy will split time with Jackson next year just like Spiller has done his whole career.

      • Ken says:

        Sproles was a 3rd down back. Very different role than how the Bills split reps between Jackson and Spiller.

  94. wyoming85 says:


  95. Al in MIA says:

    At this point, the Bills might as well sign Matt Moore and make it the AFC East outcasts coming to get revenge on the Fins, Patriots, Jets LOL.

    • Ken says:

      Bite your tongue. I can see them doing that. I think most likely they sign Hoyer. Still the achilles heel in their O. Rex loads up on D and running backs but like the old Stej days he lacks the QB.

  96. Al in MIA says:

    lol, don’t get me started

  97. getterdone says:

    OMG, and here I thought the IRS & NSA was the biggest waste and use of digital space on the web. SMH

  98. drg says:


    I think McCoy is pretty special and he’ll definitely see a ton of carries. Buffalo will play Rex ball. Run the ball 60% of the time, play field position, and try to win the game with their defense. They will play a ton of close games and might squeak into the playoffs where they could be dangerous.

    I don’t like giving up a really good young LB on a rookie deal for a declining RB with a lot of miles on him though. Think they could have saved Kiko and just spent the money in FA. McCoy may have even been a cap casualty had the trade not gone down.

    • Ken says:

      That is how I see it as well. If the Bills had a QB they would be dangerous. As it is they will be in the playoff hunt imo.

  99. getterdone says:

    Hold da phones!!!

    ESPN Ravens reporter Jamison Hensley predicts Baltimore will release LE Haloti Ngata.
    GM Ozzie Newsome has been trying to work on a new deal for Ngata in order to lower his $16 million cap hit, but nothing has materialized to this point. Ngata is refusing to kick money down the road after he had a strong season. The 31-year-old would be highly sought after if he hit the open market. Hensley mentions the Colts as a possible landing spot, reuniting Ngata with coach Chuck Pagano.

  100. getterdone says:

    Ken, the Bills now have a QB….we’ll be facing Cassel twice a year now. He could be the best that Rex has really ever had.

    Bills acquired QB Matt Cassel and a 2015 sixth-round pick from the Vikings in exchange for a 2015 fifth-round pick and 2016 seventh-round pick.
    After swinging a blockbuster deal for LeSean McCoy on Tuesday, GM Doug Whaley is back at it again Wednesday. After losing out to the Browns for Josh McCown, the Bills turned their attention to the trade market. It’s basically a salary dump by the Vikings, who save $4.75 million against the cap and further clear the quarterback room for Teddy Bridgewater. Cassel, 33 in May, appeared in 12 games (nine starts) for Minnesota the past two seasons, composing a 4-5 record with a 14:13 TD:INT ratio and 6.9 YPA average. He’s nothing more than a game manager who will compete with E.J. Manuel for the starting job.

    • jahndoh says:

      I think he had Brett Favre for one pretty good season. But I agree. Bills are a team to be reckoned with, I just don’t think the reason has anything to do with that trade for McCoy.

  101. Al in MIA says:

    True on McCoy’s drop off (age?) but he also went over 300 carries in a season for the first time in 2013 and 300 seems to be the trigger in the fantasy world for “following year drop off in production looming”. And drop off in efficiency happened in 2014 just as conventional wisdom predicted. As to splits with Sproles, McCoy’s carried it 314 times in 2013 and 312 times in 2014 so not much there but his receiving attempts were cut almost in half (targeted 65+ times between the 2010-13 seasons in pass game but only 37 times last season).

    • jahndoh says:

      All the math bodes poorly for him. Show me a RB at that age with that stark of a dropoff year over year (1 yard less per carry, 300 less yards on the same amount of carries, Receiving reps cut in half while receiving stats drop 75% or more, 11 TDs turns into 5)
      that rebounded from that?

      Look, coaches don’t trade probowl feature backs for LBs coming off an injury. McCoy isn’t what he was and won’t ever be. He’ll have a good game here and there, but if they run him like Rex Ryan likes to run runningbacks, he’s going to have 400 carries and 1200 yards to show for it next season, and he’s never going to return to what he’s most remembered for.

  102. Al in MIA says:

    Am I the only one feeling that creepy feeling that Cassel is serving as a spy for the Patriots? lol.

  103. Al in MIA says:

    Guys, whoever approves moderated messages, please approve the one I posted showing 3 hyperlinks for Jahn, lol.

  104. Ken says:

    I also don’t get the McCoy is old and broken down. He will be 27 next season.

    • jahndoh says:

      It’s more about reps than age. He’ll be in his 7th NFL season next year. I really don’t need to point out age. But he isn’t getting traded for an LB coming off an injury if he is what he once was.

  105. Al in MIA says:

    As for actual guarantees on McCoy/Watt contracts, it makes sense when you think about the deals that Ngata & Wilfork (on his previous rich contract) got which were 25-27 mill in guaranteed money. That’s what got me thinking “how the hell do you go from 25-27 mill to 51 mill in guarntees?”. The 30-35 mill appears to make more sense in progression of highest paid.

  106. Ken says:

    Bills get Matt Cassel. I feel better already. Should have signed McCown.

    • Al in MIA says:

      Bears should have been calling McCown from day 1 after he was cut. Too bad they will just burden themselves with Culter, his drama, and his salary.

      • jahndoh says:

        They can’t move on from Cutler. No matter what. They HAVE to suffer through this. They signed the contract. It was a mistake…obviously, but they are saddled with it now.

  107. Al in MIA says:

    I don’t think much will change with the Bills year over year HOWEVER, it’s always scary to think what that defense can do with a coach like Rex. If they were that motivated without a coach that really gets you excited, wonder how cocky they will really get under Ryan :/.
    Good thing their offense still blows 🙂

    • Ken says:

      If they had a legit QB their offense would be scary. Lots of good skill players with Watkins, Woods and McCoy.

      • jahndoh says:

        Takes a legit scheme too. I know you think McCoy is a worldbeater, but replace that name with Spiller/Jackson and they’re still loaded with good skill players.

        I think they’re going to be a challenge this year just like they always are, but I think it’s because Ryan will make their defense more formidable, and either Cassel OR McCown will give them better QB play than they had last season.

  108. Al in MIA says:

    Out to late lunch, take care!

  109. drg says:

    Ngata has his offseason home here in Utah. My dad lives just up the street. Last time they spoke he said he was planning on retiring at 32. Maybe things change, but I don’t know if he’s worth pursuing at this stage.

    • drg says:

      Should point out that I am a BIG supporter of getting Ngata since I would have an in to get field passes and player seats for at least one game/year.

  110. drg says:

    Interesting stat I just read:

    19 players had 250 touches last season and McCoy had the fewest yards/touch of any of them. Factor the great system he was playing in plus his salary and it looks like a smart move by Philly.

    • jahndoh says:

      Stark. The other single stat that stands out most to me, 11 TDs turns into 5TDs while the Total touches were only marginally less.

  111. Silly Tim says:

    With RBs I don’t think it’s necessarily about age, but touches. McCoy will be in his 7th season because he entered the league young. Wear and tear is the key.

  112. Mike E. says:


    I swear to you, I watched almost every Eagles game in parts. McCoy looked like a shell of what he was. There were times when Polk looked more explosive. He got 312 carries, so he better get 1300 yards. If Lamar miller had 312 carries, he’d have 1611 yards going by his YPC. McCoy was NOT the same player last year, and he was healthy. I can’t explain why, but all I can say is, I wouldn’t worry about him. You’re worrying about his name, not what he was last season.

  113. getterdone says:

    Al, Jahn, so according to you guys on a RB’s touches wearing them down….then we should all be applauding Philbin for grossly limiting Lamar Miller’s touches per game like he has. 😉

    • jahndoh says:

      Not sure if you’re trying to stir shit, but I didn’t have a problem with Lamar’s touch count last season. I think you prolong RB careers when you put them on a pitch count. When you don’t you get Jamal Anderson, Lamar Smith, and Ricky Williams (pre 1st retirement).

  114. Ken says:

    jahndoh says:
    March 4, 2015 at 2:21 pm (Edit)

    Takes a legit scheme too. I know you think McCoy is a worldbeater, but replace that name with Spiller/Jackson and they’re still loaded with good skill players.

    I think they’re going to be a challenge this year just like they always are, but I think it’s because Ryan will make their defense more formidable, and either Cassel OR McCown will give them better QB play than they had last season.
    McCown signed with Cleveland.

    • jahndoh says:

      Not my first mistake, nor last. I remembered them pursuing him I guess.

      Think my post is still pretty spot on the mistake notwithstanding.

    • jahndoh says:

      I left out that in addition of it taking a legit scheme, it takes a legit OL as well. There’s was pretty bad last year.

  115. Mike E. says:


    If McCoy’s numbers last year were elite, does that make MillerTime uber-elite? McCoy was so far from elite last year it’s not funny. in ’13, he was elite, in ’14, he was shell of his ’13 season.

  116. Mike E. says:


    I think the evidence of exactly how elite McCoy is lies in the fact that the Eagles just traded him for a promising LB who is coming off an injury, and no further compensation, not one draft pick or anything. If he was what you say, why would they do that?

  117. getterdone says:

    This has about a 99% chance of happening especially after the Bills traded away Kiko Alonso, even tho he played weak side. So Miami is out of the running I’d think.

    The New York Daily News’ Manish Mehta expects the Bills “to put on a full-court press” in trying to lure free agent ILB David Harris.
    The Bills and Jets will likely be the biggest bidders for Harris’ services, though the Falcons, Bears, and Dolphins have also been linked to the 31-year-old. Harris has been coach Rex Ryan’s “quarterback” of the defense the past six years and would probably be interested in following him to Buffalo. Harris will likely be angling for $6-8 million per year on a multi-year contract.

  118. D says:

    Lol, i posted WAY back that Bills got Cassell but took GDP posting it for anyone to notice….lol f u terds. (pun intended)

    • jahndoh says:

      I saw it. You scoop a lot of folks here all the time. I appreciate it and get a lot of my info from you!

  119. jahndoh says:

    How many guys in the league have that many yards, carries and 4.2 YPC is pretty darn good when you are getting the ball that many times.

    Well when you include carries (part of the problem with McCoy) you really limit your potential comparisons. His YPC was dwarfed by Murray though. 80 more carries, 500 more yards, and 4.7 YPC.

    • jahndoh says:

      PS, Murray is the only RB with more carries than McCoy last season. So he’s the only guy to look at.

    • Ken says:

      Murray is a stud. I was a big fan of his at OU. He just needs to stay healthy and you have to put up with a fumble or 2 with him.

  120. Silly Tim says:

    So what do you guys think of McCoy going to BUF? 😉

  121. D says:

    “I’m told the Atlanta Falcons, Miami Dolphins and New England Patriots have shown great interest in Corey Grant, who has sealed himself as a late-round pick. ” Walterfootball.
    Thats the Auburn RB that ran the sub 4.3’s at his pro day yesterday.

  122. Ken says:

    Okay McCoy sucks. So Buffalo decided to trade a promising young LB and essentially let an all world stud like Spiller go for a washed piece of junk in McCoy. Okay. I get it.

    • jahndoh says:

      Not your typical style Ken. But I’ll go ahead and consider that the signal that the conversation can only go downhill from here.

    • Mike E. says:

      Tee hee. I never said he sucks. I said last year, he played like a shell of the player that put him into the elite stratosphere, because in 2013, he WAS elite. In 2014, he was a full time starter that was average to good.

      BTW – Lamar Miller is just 7 spots behind McCoy last year, and of the top 5 RB’s in the NFL, McCoy’s 4.2 is a half a yard less per carry up to a yard less that all of the other guys.

  123. jahndoh says:

    I also saw the post about Manute Bol’s son btw D.

    My wife actually dated his nephew in HS. I watched him in his “heyday” with the Warriors back in the day.

  124. Ken says:


    Miller is a fine RB and I am happy we have him. I would take McCoy over him in a heart beat, especially when you look at McCoy as a receiver. I think the biggest impact the Sproles acquisition had on McCoy’s production last year is that it took McCoy out of the game in passing situations and they were using Sproles in that role. That is where the biggest drop off in production was for McCoy.

    • Mike E. says:

      OK, but why would they do that? Why get Sproles in the first place, and then why let McCoy go? Look, we’ll see what happens with Shady this season. At this point, any further discussion is probably pointless. It’s very clear why BUF made the trade, Alonso doesn’t fit the scheme, and Spiller is a FA. Why PHI made the trade tends to point more that he’s on the decline.

  125. getterdone says:

    Scoop D, sorry, I didn’t see your previous post of the same Cassel news. All I saw was all you terds dancing weird…Ghey! lol

    • D says:

      Lol wasnt posting about you posting it, just that right after it happened i saw a twitter update and i posted something about him being traded and how desparate Bills must be to keep Manuel benched and its was like *crickets* Then you came along and posted it and BOOM discussion on lol. Im joking anyway it happens on here all the time like that.

  126. D says:

    Did you hear that the Bills traded a 5th and a 7th to Minnesota for Matt Cassel though?
    Yeah i think GDP said something about that…. lol

  127. The Flying Pig says:

  128. Silly Tim says:

    I’m gonna go dance with those girls. LOL

  129. D says:

    jahndoh says:
    March 4, 2015 at 2:52 pm
    I also saw the post about Manute Bol’s son btw D.

    My wife actually dated his nephew in HS. I watched him in his “heyday” with the Warriors back in the day.
    There was a link in it to a video about him, which i thought was pretty good. Id be ticked though if my name was Bol Bol

  130. getterdone says:

    D, don’t let it bother ya…I post stuff all the time and get crickets too. Happens to all of us. Especially when the rest of the blog is off on some dumb convo about pickles or posting silly pictures….LOL

  131. D says:

    Adam Schefter
    8 mins ·

    Peyton Manning and Broncos are near agreement on new contract for the 2015 season in which he will take $4 million pay-cut, per @mortreport and @Jeff_Legwold.

  132. D says:

    Tim likes a man in uniform….

  133. Silly Tim says:

    GD dancing in the club.

  134. D says:

    The Bulldogs’ pro day is tomorrow, Wednesday, but I’m already told there will be a crowd on hand for Benardrick McKinney. Nearly a dozen linebacker coaches are expected to watch McKinney, who’s been drawing strong interest from the Dallas Cowboys, New York Giants,Miami Dolphins, Chicago Bears and New York Jets, who are meeting with the linebacker for dinner this evening.

    Follow Tony Pauline @TonyPauline.
    Bet he is fucking stuffed after that many dinners in one night.

  135. getterdone says:

    This could help push someone we need to us @ #14. Hopefully White.

    NFL Media’s Daniel Jeremiah says the Falcons will select a pass rusher with pick No. 8.
    Jeremiah mentions the likes of Vic Beasley, Shane Ray, Dante Fowler Jr. and Randy Gregory all as options at No. 8.

  136. D says:

    James Walker ‏@JamesWalkerNFL 5m5 minutes ago

    #Dolphins mailbag: Mike Wallace trade for Andre Johnson? http://espn.go.com/blog/miami-dolphins/post/_/id/13576/dolphins-mailbag-mike-wallace-trade-for-andre-johnson
    Now this fucker is doing it…..

    • getterdone says:

      It could happen if Philbin has anything to do with it…lol

    • stangerx says:

      ONe of the other Qs was about Knowshon. This I disagree with: “Knowshon Moreno is an aging, injury-prone running back.” Injuries sure, but dude is 27. We saw what he can do, even if just for a bit. Worth a shot on the cheap. Bet we can get him for a couple mil plus some incentives we’d be glad to pay if it works out.

  137. D says:

    Saints Reportedly Fielding Trade Offers For LB Curtis Lofton http://bit.ly/1zYGNhM
    I had heard about a month ago he might be a cap causality and was interested then, dunno what they would want in trade but he is a pretty good LB.

  138. getterdone says:

    This is why we need a big WR that can do it all.

    NFL Media analyst Charles Davis notes that with West Virginia WR Kevin White’s “size and strength,” he “can break short routes Big.”
    “Kevin White, WR, W.Virginia-Yes, he makes a lot of big plays over the top, but with his size and strength, no doubt he can break short routes Big,” Davis tweeted. The West Virginia prospect is a natural turning and getting up field after the catch. The 6-foot-3, 215-pound White isn’t the easiest to bring down in the open field, and has the size and the power to make smaller defenders pay.

  139. stangerx says:

    Don’t know how to do the short repeating things, but if we are talking dancing…..even has the NFL theme.

  140. D says:

    Broncos delaying the inevitable, but i guess goes hand in hand tagging Thomas. Win next year with Peyton or full on rebuild mode and let Thomas hit FA next year.

  141. The Flying Pig says:

  142. D says:

    Miko Grimes ‏@iHeartMiko 3m3 minutes ago

    Where? RT @RedBlurr: @iheartmiko Trust us…we know. Another major franchise mistake that set us back for years. At least we have our QB now.
    Damn Brent, couldnt you have married a less yappy bitch….jeeze.

  143. The Flying Pig says:

    When we sign Suh 😉
    I think we need an OG with any money left

    Then we can draft like this
    1st trade down and pick up extra 2nd
    1 WR
    2a LB1
    2b LB2
    That’s right 2 LBs in the 2nd one ILB and one OLB
    3 DB
    4 WR
    5 RB/OL depth
    6 RB/OL depth
    7 RB/OL depth or another DB

    Obviously we only need RB

  144. getterdone says:

    So nobody watched the brief 1 min clip on Darren Waller 6’6 238 33.5″ arms 4.46 40 & 37″ vert & combine leading 11.35 sec 60yd shuttle.
    Plus Ga Tech receivers are known for their blocking with the triple option they run.

    • D says:

      I watched it, but i already know and am on board with your idea, we have even talked that he could play hybrid TE/WR

      • getterdone says:

        Right, I was big on him way back. Yes, he could be a better hybrid WR/TE than Funchess…IMO.

    • jahndoh says:

      60 yard shuttle? We’re talking about American football right? Worthless measurement.

      Credit to his 40 and vert though. Pretty damn good for a man of that size. Can he block?

  145. Ken says:

    I still do not realistically see how we can afford Suh and have any money left to extend Tannehill, fix WR and OL.

    • The Flying Pig says:

      There is defiantly enough $ for Tanny and Suh
      I don’t think there is any reason to even discuss that

      We draft 2 WRs and we are fine

      I’m guessing the FO has more faith in Billy Turner than we know
      You can get low cost OGs
      It’s not a premium position

      • getterdone says:

        What about LB, FS, CB, RB for short yardage? 😉

      • Ken says:

        It’s a not a premium position but we have been trying to fix this OL too long. We need to get it right because I truly believe fixing the OL is the key to this team taking the next step. It will help Tannehill and it will help Miller. Detroit has a had a fearsome DL for years with a quality QB and elite WR and they have not won a playoff game.

      • jahndoh says:

        I’m going assume you meant to say defiantly, because definitely in that sentence would lead me to question your sobriety. LOL.

    • D says:

      Its doable, thats all i can say, i have gone through some examples of how. Thats not to say its smartest move, because it does kinda hem us in on cap and in a few years we would have to be rotating someone out. Then again, even if we spend it differently, we still will be spending it and we will still have to make same kinda moves later. Only real difference is filling one hole on our team with a all pro, or filling multiple hole with good players.

      • stangerx says:

        For sure we could do it. Q is should we. Only in favor of it I see is that Starks’ money would go towards his salary, but that leaves me hoping that Mitchell and Fede are ready to step up big time.

  146. D says:

    getterdone says:
    March 4, 2015 at 4:05 pm
    LMAO, I think he did marry Omar, Omar is living a duel life….the black Bruce Jenner….lol
    BTW, who or WTF is she talking about?
    In that tweet, someone was tweeting to her “Trust us…we know. Another major franchise mistake that set us back for years. At least we have our QB now.” her reply to him was….”Where?”

  147. Silly Tim says:

    Ken, zip it on Suh will ya. It is known. LOL

  148. getterdone says:

    Tim, I have a feeling Brent Grimes wears those Bose headphones around the house all day when he’s home.

  149. getterdone says:

    Saints released RB Pierre Thomas.

    • D says:

      If he wasnt such a worn down workhorse id say thats a bruiser to look at but dude’s tires have metal showing.

    • Silly Tim says:

      He’s actually a vet back I would look into at a low cost. He can do anything you want a back to do. He’s not a feature back and never has been so he knows the role.

    • getterdone says:

      He’s actually no bigger than Miller.

  150. The Flying Pig says:

    Your Suh pessimism cannot break me

  151. getterdone says:

    1-on-1 With Ryan Tannehill

    Dolphins QB Ryan Tannehill talks with John Congemi of The Finsiders as Tannehill participates in an Adidas BOOST event at Trump National at Doral, the site of this year’s Fins Weekend golf event. Watch for Tannehill comments about his excitement to enter his second year in Bill Lazor’s offensive system.


  152. D says:


    Oh wow……………………………….seriously???………………………………………..

  153. jahndoh says:

    Ken says:
    March 4, 2015 at 4:24 pm
    It’s a not a premium position but we have been trying to fix this OL too long. We need to get it right because I truly believe fixing the OL is the key to this team taking the next step. It will help Tannehill and it will help Miller. Detroit has a had a fearsome DL for years with a quality QB and elite WR and they have not won a playoff game.
    Couldn’t agree more Ken. Tannehill was amongst the best in the league when given time last season. Makes sense to invest in his health at this point.
    CAN we afford Tannehill AND Suh…sure. But in practice is that a smart way to do it? Seems very ill advised to me. Maybe they think we’re a year away from a superbowl though, but even then, they’re going to have to pay Tannehill Joe Flacco money. Can’t buy championships.

  154. Al in MIA says:

    I’m back.

    Mike E,

    I’m sure Buffalo traded Lynch to Seattle because he was on the decline :P.

    Is that also why Denver traded Clinton Portis to Washington for Champ Bailey?

    Chip is perhaps in the camp of Mike Shanahan’s RB philosophy -> The system makes the running game not the player’s special talents.

    Frank Gore and Adrian Peterson are still rushing away at McCoy’s 2014 average per carry with more NFL mileage logged to date than McCoy.

    This move by Philly/Buffalo is Chip leveraging his offensive scheme, getting his own players, and improving defense with a bargaining chip in McCoy. Buffalo is simply using its surplus at LB to meet a starter need they have at RB. Yes age had something to do with it but if Buffalo can get 3-4 more seasons out of McCoy then its worked out well for them.

    The key is keeping the RB below 300 carries in a season

    Some evidence points to that…

    Do Massive Workloads Equal Big Declines in Running Back Productivity? – Fantasy Football Analytics

    • jahndoh says:

      You’re putting way too much stock in a fantasy football analysis that never addresses whether a running back can EVER bounce back once that production decline happens.

      Lynch was not the world beater ever, not at Cal, not in Buffalo that he became in Seattle. Portis for Bailey was a blockbuster with 2 top tier players. That example is horrible unless your’e trying to tell me Alonzo is tantamount to Champ Bailey, a sure fire 1st ballot HOFer.

  155. Al in MIA says:

    You also can’t buy chemistry 😦

  156. The Flying Pig says:

    Al dancing with a girl after we sign Suh

  157. Al in MIA says:

    stangerx says:
    March 4, 2015 at 4:28 pm

    For sure we could do it. Q is should we. Only in favor of it I see is that Starks’ money would go towards his salary, but that leaves me hoping that Mitchell and Fede are ready to step up big time.
    Don’t sleep on Johnson (Anthony) lol.

  158. Al in MIA says:


  159. Silly Tim says:

    Hey look, I’m known for doing this.

  160. jahndoh says:

    You also can’t buy chemistry 😦

    • Al in MIA says:

      To the discussion that you can’t buy a championship. Most people put stock in a players individual talent with production earned elsewhere and discount chemistry. Marshall in Miami and now Wallace in Miami.

  161. jahndoh says:

    Yo guys, all the moving Gifs and Vines are seriously slowing this page down. Try to reign it in a bit. They’re all funny of course. 🙂

  162. dbolt48 says:

    So today’s article inspired postings if Bruce Jenner and Dancing retards….God I hope we never go undefeated again😂

    • olddolphan says:

      DON’T WORRY DBOLT; AS long as the Ross/T-Baum/Philbin crew is calling the shots we’ll never come close to an undefeated season!! But you MIGHT see Bruce Jenner and the Dancing Retards for a halftime show!!!!!!!!!

  163. BoulderPhinfan says:

    so now I read we’re considering Suh? I guess we never learn.

  164. dbolt48 says:

    You also can’t buy chemistry 😦

    Proper response would’ve been “But you can buy a Dildo!”

  165. Ken says:

    Gotta run. Peace to you all.

  166. dbolt48 says:

    Shit, if the Saints cut Curtis Lofton Id be interested

  167. Al in MIA says:

    Both McCoy and Alonso came into the NFL with similar expectations (R2; Alonso #46 overall & McCoy #52 overall). That said, Alonso is much younger and has the potential to be a superstar based on the sample size he provided in his rookie season but he’s also coming off major injury.

    McCoy has only rushed over 300 times in a season in each of the last two seasons. Before 2013? Lesean rushed only 200 times in 2012 (due to injury), 273 times in 2011, 207 in 2010, and 155 in his rookie season. All for a career total of 1462 attempts through 6 seasons.

    Marshawn Lynch? 1452 attempts through his first 6 NFL seasons.
    The first time Lynch crossed 300 attempts in a season? 2012 where he averaged a career best 5.0 per carry. 2013? crossed 300 attempts again but his y/c was down to 4.2 same as McCoy’s this season. 2014 saw Lynch bounce back up to 4.7

    I won’t bother with Gore’s numbers but he’s been alright going into his 11th season now with more carries through his first 6 seasons than McCoy.

    Even LaDanian Tomlinson who carried 300+ every season (at an alarming 335+ carry average per season) for 7 straight seasons was able to hold up his production through his 7th season. He declined in years 8 and 9 but had a slight bounce back in a reduced carry role in NY for a season before bowing out.

    • jahndoh says:

      I want to give you huge credit for all the research, but on one hand you cite that when they exceed 300 carries is when you run into a problem, but then you argue that McCoy coming off his second 300 carry season in a row isn’t a problem. Then you cite Thomlinson (who’s heyday was long enough ago I don’t know how relevant it is) which seems to further discount the 300 carry a season thing.

      It’s kind of all over the place. I stand by this: You don’t trade a game changing skill position player for a LB with all of 2nd round potential who’s yet to live up to it coming off a major injury. So something has to give.

      • jahndoh says:

        PS, do Gore’s numbers support the thesis? What is the thesis? You think something magical happens DURING the season when they carry the ball 300 times? Is the 301st carry and all succeeding carries so poor as to drag down what would have already been a great YPC average? Or is it that the football Gods know the RB is going to exceed 300 carries and thus downgrades the YPC pre-emptively? Because the studies you reference focus on the next seasons production. So….anyway, I feel like your’e data dumping but the thesis is moving in the progress.

      • getterdone says:

        Some coaches are just funny like that Jahn. Maybe Kelly thinks he can do well with Sproles as he’s done, he’s got some talent in the background developing, and he may be targeting drafting one in this RB rich draft class. Plus you don’t pay over $7M for a RB in today’s pass happy NFL. You just don’t.

  168. getterdone says:

    I’d really like to take a look at this kid, he’s 26, has some game, is quick. Was IR’d after 9 games due to a concussion, so wasn’t a leg injury. He could fit in with what Coyle likes to do. Keep in mind these are the kinda guys we have to sign if we go big with Suh.

    Free agent WLB Jacquian Williams will test the open market.
    Williams was a full-time starter prior to landing on I.R. last season, recording 78 tackles over nine games. He should be limited to backup offers in free agency.

  169. Silly Tim says:

    I heard Chip Kelly wants more of a north/south runner.

  170. getterdone says:

    Adam Beasley @AdamHBeasley
    ICYMI: Mike Wallace thinks he’ll remain with the Dolphins, dad says

    • D says:

      Yeah read that earlier today but since i prefer stories with happy endings, im pretending this one didnt happen.

  171. jahndoh says:

    Gotta close this page down. Catch you folks on flip side.

  172. olddolphan says:

    DBOLT; Answer for you below your 5:16 post RE:Bruce Jenner and the Dancing Retards.

  173. getterdone says:

    D, I’m ok with Wallace staying another year if his attitude issue has been addressed and if he makes a commitment to change for the better.

  174. getterdone says:

    Hickey needs to look into making this deal/trade happen!
    Wilhoite is 28, been with SF all 3 yrs of his career.
    In 2014 over 16gms he put up 87 tckls, 2 INT’s, 1 FF, 6 PD’s. He’s very versatile inside or out.

    The Sacramento Bee reports the 49ers have placed exclusive rights free agent ILB Michael Wilhoite on the trade block.
    The 49ers have a surplus of inside linebackers with Patrick Willis, Chris Borland and Navorro Bowman all returning next year. Wilhoite was a 16-game starter in 2014, but would be limited to a backup role if re-signed. San Francisco is seeking a sixth- or seventh-round pick for Wilhoite.

    • CavalierKong says:

      The Niners are a LB producing machine. I’d take a long look at making that move. A 6th or 7th is worth it.

      • getterdone says:

        It really is a good move for that. Takes some pressure off of drafting a rook and expecting results day one.

  175. getterdone says:

    I keep throwing hidden gems out there while you guys drool over a boy named Suh!

  176. CavalierKong says:

    Omar Kelly ‏@OmarKelly 3m3 minutes ago
    The only possible contender for Suh might me Washington. A Steve Ross vs. Dan Snyder showdown. This might get interesting.

    Omar Kelly ‏@OmarKelly 5m5 minutes ago
    Word on the street regarding Suh is that when Steve Ross is involved you better be prepared to big high. Teams think Suh to Miami is done.

    No shit?

  177. finfanrob says:

    so i see suh is all the talk still. might at well just give up on the season if he is signed. there is no way in hell roger will let him play against tammy. all the money only to get suspended.

  178. getterdone says:

    If we land Suh, then these hidden low cost gems are what we’ll have to do to fill other position needs.

  179. CavalierKong says:

    The biggest concern I have with signing Suh is him being 1 mistake away from a year long suspension but I was reading someone that said with the new CBA his “transgressions” have been reset and last year’s Rodgers stomp counted as strike 1, so his next mistake will only be a game or 4 games max. Anybody know if this is accurate?

    • getterdone says:

      I’d hope we have a suspension clause to make him agree to that will save us a lot of cap money should he get stupid again.

  180. Silly Tim says:

    Looks like one more snow storm before a lot of good early spring weather kicks in next week.

    • herdfan says:

      Yep, supposed to get somewhere between 8-12 inches here. It was over 60 degrees yesterday and it’s been raining all day today. If it had been colder today and the rain had been snow I think it would be over my head by now. Now we have flooding because all the snow from before melted and with the rain today, it’s a wet muddy mess. School has already been cancelled tomorrow and rumors that my work may be cancelled. So have to say, LETS GO SNOW!!!

    • Mike E. says:

      Yeah, I wonder what my company is going to do. They might open for the afternoon or evening session, but I’d think the morning session will be cancelled. If it’s still snowing through the afternoon, they might cancel the entire schedule.

      • Silly Tim says:

        I think you’re getting more than me as the south and central are getting more. Be safe.

  181. getterdone says:

    The highest-paid player at every position in 2014 combined for just two playoff wins, both coming from Cowboys Jason Witten and Brandon Carr. If these players are worth paying that much, why isn’t it translating to on-field success?


    • getterdone says:

      The Patriots won a Super Bowl paying Tom Brady, Rob Gronkowski and Darrelle Revis a combined $27.2 million, per Spotrac.

  182. Silly Tim says:

    J.J. Watt is a very special player. Even though Suh can’t do what Watt does because he’s not that kind of athlete, Watt could not be the force that Suh is inside as a DT on regular basis either because he doesn’t have Suh’s power.

    • Mike E. says:

      It doesn’t make a difference. Watt is more versatile and also more dominant than Suh. Suh shouldn’t get paid more, but that’s up to the owner who opens his checkbook, not me or you.

    • getterdone says:

      I’m still advocating saving money by signing 26yo Stephen Paea who set a combine record 49 reps on the bench in 2011. He’s kinda overlooked because of that horrible Bears D in 2013, but he’s been pretty solid. I’m interested in what he could do here.

  183. Mike E. says:


    Is that right? This is not the typical north and west storm? If that’s the case, we should definitely be closing. I’ve seen 4-8″ and snow starting from about midnight lasting until about 7PM tomorrow. I think if it does last that long, we’ll close. Any chance your place opens tomorrow?

    • Silly Tim says:

      You’re projected 4-8 and we’re 2-5. I left my computer on at work so if it’s worse than what’s expected I can log in from home and still get some stuff done.

  184. getterdone says:

    Mike, a young NT/DT Paea had 33 tkls, 6 sacks, 2 FF, 3 PD’s in 2014, his best season out of 4.

  185. Silly Tim says:

    My view on Suh is if we’re all hot and heavy for him than I’ll just roll with what we do because there’s nothing we can do about it anyway. There are lots of ways to make the cap work and then in future years we do more clearing. I’m more focused on hitting in the draft.

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