Wondering where I was lately?
I was checking out draft prospects of course!
Oh and one more thing…
I found religion!
No more planet destruction for me
No more killing of lifeforms
I’ve turned over a new life.
And now I love all things in the universe
See it all started when I met the wonderful Xxuanoahs of Moon 32
We found this mysterious obelisk together
And we worship it now!
Oh yeah…I also discovered a terrific prospect – Budda Baker
Budda Baker is an undersized safety from Washington
Yes undersized – the cat is out of the bag already.
At 5’9, 195 pounds Budda Baker does not have prototypical NFL size
But don’t be a foolish Earthling and judge Budda so harshly
Baker will tell you himself:
“God made me this height, and all I can say is watch the film. We always talk about how the film will set you free, so now matter how tall you are, how big you are, if you watch the film everything will take care of itself”.
It’s Baker’s commitment to film study and his craft that has him ranked as a 2nd round prospect in the upcoming draft.
Baker is physical enough to take down ball carriers in the NFL. He doesn’t shy away from contact.
All that film study helps him diagnose the play and take at the ball carriers feet from under him.
And occasionally he will lay a good hit not on the ball carrier.
But that is really not what makes special
What jumps out about Baker, besides some great instincts and football smarts, is how much field he covers.
Baker is rangy and accelerates quickly
At the combine, Baker showed good speed running a 4.45 40.
He also recorded a 6.76 3 cone drill and 4.08 20 yard shuttle showing off his athleticism and his high school track past.
Baker started for Washington since he was a Freshman
He proved himself to be very durable since then, starting 40 of 41 games since his Freshman year.
All those starts helped him accumulate five interceptions, 18 pass breakups, 199 tackles, 13 tackles for a loss and 4 sacks during his career. He led the Huskies in tackles in 2016.
Because of his size and his position, you see a lot of scouting comparisons to pro bowlers Bob Sanders and the Tyrone Mathieu
But I like to compare him to an explosive obelisk
…oh about that finding religion stuff…um…well I lied
The Obelisk was a bomb I placed on Moon 32…
hee hee
If I was to compare Budda Baker to an Alien Weapon of Destruction, I would compare him to the Exploding Sucker Oblisk of Mood 32
You can watch Baker’s highlights here!
Finsmob Unleashed 
Nice job Wedge. Personally, I love Budda Baker. He has great instincts, can cover, and is not afraid to stick his nose in to make a tackle. My guess is he doesn’t make it out of the late first/early second round.
After just watching his tape, he could either play S or nickel for us. Dude looks like a CB.
That’s the same things they’re saying about Peppers, and the drawback is why draft him in the first, if you’re going to play him at nickel.
Which part is Earl Thomas? Maybe he could luck into an INT once in awhile? 1 INT total?
Earl Thomas as a Freshman and Sophomore only had 10 INT’s.
NOT Earl Thomas!!!
Michigan didn’t really use him to play center field
So they kind of took it away from position to get ints and it worked to make them one of the best defenses in the country
Even if he was a LB Piggy, 1 INT. I just don’t see the comparison to Earl Thomas
Right on time with the safety scouting report
Good work Piggy! Safeties!!!
Didn’t Peppers mainly play close to the LOS as a LB?
He played all over the place, and sacrificed his stats for the good of the team. He’ll be that guy, that when he’s off the field it will look like your D is awful and very good when he’s out there. He cleans up a lot of the missed tackles, that would’ve helped us against Pitt.
Michigan had a great defense last year
And Peppers was probably the #1 reason for that
Like you said he sacrificed his own numbers for the good of the team
Michigan and Alabama were pretty much the best 2 defenses in CFB in ’16
Yes
That scouting report GDP posted last week gives you a real good idea of what he did
I don’t think there is a more versatile player than Peppers this year
I suspect he would put up bigger int numbers if he used as a safety
We’re on the same page with Peppers, which is why I wanted to take him at 22, but don’t think he’ll be there, so I changed it to McDowell.
Peppers is a tracker, with good makeup speed, that takes great angles to the ball carrier. When I watch him make a tackle downfield, he’s the guy running in a different direction than every other defender. He runs to the spot the ball carrier will be when he gets there.
When I played DE, this is how I pursued the ball carrier, OV does the same thing, and I mentioned it when we drafted him. When I watch other DL I feel like they’re loafing when they don’t do this. Phillips get a bad rap for this.
S-s-s-s
A-a-a-a
F-f-f-f
E-e-e-e
T-t-t-t
Y-y-y-y
Pig — you sold me on the Budda in the awesome write.
Seems you are concentrating on safeties and lbs this year and with Peppers one who could be both. You thought about the name for the hitting and cover guys with skills? Samurais have been done….seems this year it is something like ninjas who hit the weight room.
I’m going to get into some of the pass rushers too
I just want to get younger/better on D in general
Can’t argue with that one bit other than in the first round, but that is just in case value is there. Would be real happy if we just get one guy on OL in the first three rounds, a D playmaker, and everyone else looking good on special teams.
Good write up, Piggy. Baker is definitely a good prospect. Doesn’t have prototype size but he’s a good football player.
I now feel sorry for the FSU fans
Joe ReedyVerified account @joereedy 60m60 minutes ago
More
ESPN announces that Rex Ryan will make his network debut by calling the #FSU Spring Game on Saturday
Rexie is a colorful character, so he should do good in the booth. I hated him coaching the Bills, because I knew he had our number, until last year. I don’t want him coaching again. Say what you want about him, but he’s a good coach.
steveccnv says:
April 3, 2017 at 11:35 am (Edit)
We’re on the same page with Peppers, which is why I wanted to take him at 22, but don’t think he’ll be there, so I changed it to McDowell.
******************
Honestly
If you want to invest all of our offseason capital into overtaking the Patriots
Peppers is the perfect weapon for that
Is there any other prospect available who will help us defend that short passing game?
I get his positional ambiguity as a negative
but he is a good football player and will help us slow down Brady IMO
I hadn’t thought of that, but yeah I can see that happening. He can lock up on Edelman.
Sacrificed stats. That may be the funniest statement ever.
ZERO forced fumbles, ZERO fumble recoveries, ONE interception. Such a thankless player, God Bless him.
I’d have to watch more game tape of him to see why he’s not getting the stats, but based on those stats I get your point. Some guys just have the IT factor, I think he does.
Why?
I see you answered it before I posted.
Anyway . . . LET’S GO METS!!!
51s
I like Peppers, but he’s never blown me away when I watched him. Michigan played Utah twice the last two years and I don’t remember him standing out even once.
Baker is a good player for sure. Washington had a great secondary last year.
Still like Marcus Williams better at safety for us though. I’m a homer.
Peppers not standing out…He’s a defender, sometimes that’s a good thing.
Off topic, but the new head coach of Georgetown basketball is……Patrick Ewing. Like that a lot.
How the mighty have fallen.
Good to see that Gase has a plan in place for Pouncey, but still makes it seem he has a lingering issue.
“You’ll see him out there in bubble wrap. Mike doesn’t need a lot of practice reps. We’re going to do what we need to do to make sure he’s ready. After that, it’s going to be … I’m going to find out how many snaps we need him to take, if any, and then my goal is to get him out there on Sunday.”
http://www.miamidolphins.com/news/article-1/Dolphins-Have-A-Plan-In-Place-For-Pouncey/efafcee6-b420-40a1-b919-cb00c9a70e56
Peppers is a great athlete, no denying that, but it’s hard to say he’s a playmaker when he hasn’t really made plays. Assuming he’s used in a similar role he played in college, where he’s a nickel LB, or maybe a safety who plays up in the box, why would he all of a sudden start making plays, when he didn’t do it at Michigan?
13 tackles for losses and 3 sacks this past season makes me think he played more front 7 than backend. Not sure if he’s a safety but as you said very good athlete.
I think it’s worth while to watch the scouting tape GDP posted last week
His job in the wolverine defense last season was basically to funnel the play inside
Teams went away from him
The statistic you are ignoring is Michigan team defensive statistics
Michagan was 2 in the country in points against and 2 vs the run
Before the season starts they basically move Peppers from DB to OLB bc their LB unit was weak
This is a guy who puts team stats before personal stats
That’s what WOLBs do, funnel the play back inside.
That was new to him in ’16
He played CB and safety for them prior to ’16
I imagine his stats would be better if he played safety
It’s not just his versatily in defense that’s a plus
It’s that he can play ST and even take some offensive snaps as well
Watch his tape, where ever he is on the field he runs to the spot the ball carrier will intersect with him, instead of to the spot he is now, like so many defenders do, especially when they’re dogging it.
Basically you have a cleaner on the back end, when others miss the tackle he’s always there to clean up.
Piggy
It takes more than one player to have a great defense. Just not sure if he’s special enough. Not sure exactly where he fits. Do you think he can all of a sudden learn how to cover at safety? That’s quite a project.
He has played safety before he just didn’t do it in 16
I think he will play nickel right out of the gate
I also think he will play ST and bring a little soemthing to that unit
I just think he is the ultimate anti-Brady available this draft and he’s a great athlete
I wouldn’t play him at OLB full time
But he may even be able to fit that role against a heavy passing team
Take Polumalu out of the Pitt D, when he was there and they sucked, he’s a different player, but that’s what he means to a D, and he’s a great cover guy, I see a little Dion SandCastle in him 😛
https://twitter.com/MDCheer/status/848975559476613120
Fasano on why he left the Phins.
“That’s one of the reasons I left. I just didn’t see the team going in a direction. I knew I was whatever — on the back nine of my career.I was here five years and kind of needed a change of pace.”
And on why on the team now.
“I’m excited to be back.The building feels a lot different. They definitely have some fight to them and I think Gase is a great coach, a young coach. I’m excited about everything going on. He’s no nonsense, there’s no distractions, it’s all about football. I think he’s done a great job building the team.”
Michael J. Katz @NFLAGENTKATZ
Happy to announce that @CSETalent client @ZachBrown_55 has agreed to terms with the @Redskins
——————-
I figure he is far more a Snyder guy than a Gase one.
Now we can move on from that.
Piggy
I know he played safety before, but again, ZERO INT’s. How is he a playmaker when he can’t come up with a single INT as a safety? That’s what worries me. I know he’s a versatile player, but is he really exceptional at anything? It doesn’t appear so, and that’s why I don’t like him as our pick
If you’re saying he’s the kind of guy that can cover Edelman, maybe he is, I just don’t know if that’s enough a reason to draft him instead of some other guys like Lamp, Reddick, Foster, or one of the DE’s
Use Deone Bucannon as a comparison, he had 15 INT’s in college. Sure, he was used differently, but at least he has exceptional production, and because of his athleticism, ARZ uses him as a S, LB, and maximizes his value.
I would draft Foster in front of him
I would also draft few of the edge guys in front of him
not Reddick and/or Lamp
Both of those guys are changing positions and are from smaller schools
not sure how you can hold Peppers conversion to safety against him
and not hold moving Lamp to OG or Reddick to LB against them especially when the competition they faced is not on par with Michigan
I like both players but I expect a bigger transition from both players than I would with Peppers who can at least contribute on ST as well
covering Edelman (or Cooks) is a good reason to take a player at 22 IMO
Being able to slow the Patriots offense down in ’17 and beyond might be a difference maker for us
they easily tore us apart in ’16
OK, with Reddick, at least he’s big enough to play LB with the big boys, and will definitely be a LB in the NFL, not a jack of all trades, master of none. As far as Lamp is concerned, he’s played OG before, and excelled there. He excelled every spot he played, so no worries there. Doesn’t mean I’m right, but those are the reasons I’d go with Reddick or Lamp before Peppers.
Maybe Tanny needs to give everyone a “Mike E” Special to get the offence going? 😉
https://twitter.com/HEATLES_EAGLES/status/848959608312004608
Gronk looks really relaxed
I get all the pros and cons of Peppers and so do most scouts. You really have to believe you have a role for him and see upside in it.
I can see him starting off on STs even on some returns, and nickel and dime packages. I don’t see him starting anywhere right away. If you project him playing 25 snaps on defense then a 1st rd pick is valid. If it’s more like 10-12, not so sure about that.
I think Reddick will have a lesser learning curve as an OLB than Peppers as a pure Safety. Reddick is also a good athlete who will have to learn more coverage, but he’s still a pure front 7 player and he can also provide some pass rush even if just weak side blitzes that we use often. He might be a really good wide 9 OLB.
I believe Lamp played 3 games at right guard his redshirt freshman year(2013). He did nothing special there, but he didn’t suck up either….as far as I can tell. Almost his whole college career was at LT. Nobody knows if he can play guard in the NFL, for certain. People are just pretty sure he can’t play LT. We have never seen him play guard against top quality interior defenders.
He falls into the Zack Martin projection and even Tunsil moving to guard his rookie year. But most feel he will be a quality NFL O-lineman somewhere.
Tim,
People said the same thing about Billy Turner too.He is absolutely not the player Zack Martin was. He’s getting hyped because this is bad interior lineman draft.
Billy Turner was never considered a 1st rd pick. I didn’t say Lamp is as good as Zack Martin, I said same scenario, most NFL teams saw him as a guard in the NFL, not a LT.
I want front 7 1st round anyway, not a guard or safety. 😉
Tim,
I meant people said Turner could just slide in and play guard when…as I said would happen…he couldn’t play tackle in the NFL. He sucked….and he is a small school guy just like Lamp. Lamp is, at best, a second round talent. The OL in this draft are just very ordinary.
***
Just my .02. If people wanna go draft him…so be it. I like his attitude and compete factor.
No parachute!
Adam SchefterVerified account @AdamSchefter 3h3 hours ago
More
Former Dolphins DE/OLB Dion Jordan cleared waivers today. Now a free agent…
He’s done, he just doesn’t have the desire. We gave him every chance to make a comeback.
I’m told this trash bin is also a free agent
between the 2 I think I want to sign the trash bin
I’m ok if Landry walks in 2018, so I think, if he doesn’t sign a contract extension before the start of the season, it leaves it open for Carroo to steal his role in 2018. I think Landry needs the Fins more than they need him. I’d like to retain him, but I’m not paying him over $10M per year. You might even see Thomas being more of a 3rd down specialist than Landry this year.
https://twitter.com/MDCheer/status/849049880475582464
Steve – I’m not okay if Landry walks. And I think he gets $12-15M a year.
I don’t want him to leave, but if you pay him that kind of money it’s not a good sign. Go look at the cheats payroll, they don’t pay squat, that’s why they always seem to have enough depth. Even Brady isn’t being paid much $15M I think, which tells me there’s something stinky there. I’d bet he’s got some kind of wink, wink deal with Kraft. How can he only make that salary, when you’ve got guys that suck making $20M?
Brady has a wife who pulls down a 1/4 billion dollars plus a year. What he makes is mice nuts…pocket money.
tend to think Landry has the attitude that sets the tone for this team
to me its not the same team
I love the way this team was so scrappy last year
I think we may even want to consider changing our logo
Let’s see what kind of season Landry has in 2017 first. He does set a tempo for us with his physical and emotional play. He’s a talented WR despite great size and speed. But his numbers do not match those high figures. I want to see him on the field with Stills, Parker and now Thomas first to see what he is. Also the offense being curtailed around Ajayi and the running game. The passing stats may be more spread out. Sometimes it’s not about total stats but production pct.
Wins trump everything. I want to see a good 3 phase football team, not reliant on one thing.
I want to see
TOM BRADY BLEED
(Piggy bites off a piece of raw meat)
Yes Tim, production pct, I’ve used something similar in the past. I don’t want the 170 throws and 85 catches like Brandon Marshall gets. Just make the play when you’re called upon on O, it doesn’t matter who gets what numbers, and be productive when it matters. The wins will come.
Now that we haven’t signed Brown, doesn’t that mean we have money to spend on Landry in 17
Let’s do it!
Opening Day… renaming the field “Rickey Henderson Field”. I know a lot of you hate baseball, but I love it!
He’s one of my all time favorite players.
I wore his jersey to work today. lot’s of strange looks here in S. Texas. lol
Mets fans
😳
https://twitter.com/sinow/status/849056789861683202
As per usghe the refs have made themselves more important than the game, everyone seems to be in foul trouble.
https://twitter.com/theflyingpig44/status/849098673120215040
Randy,
Lamp is still DIV I talent who played against DIV I teams like Alabama and held his own. Turner played in the FCS which doesn’t play against DIV I talent. Small school guys but still a big difference.
And remember, we had 3 guys in Martin, Thomas and Douglas who couldn’t cut the mustard and they weren’t from small schools.
I agree, I think Randy is off base with Lamp, he played very good against Alabama, even though I’m not sold on Alabama’S individual players going head to head. I think Lou has put more effort into scouting Lamp, than Randy has.
not getting the McDowell love at all. 1st rd DT’s need to be dominant and he’s not.
He’s versatile and has Suh type of quickness, perfect for a 4-3 DT, he can also play on the outside like Suh does.
sb7mvp says:
April 3, 2017 at 12:40 pm
S-s-s-s
A-a-a-a
F-f-f-f
E-e-e-e
T-t-t-t
Y-y-y-y
https://m.youtube.com/0a382d63-a93a-4acf-878f-dbcc6d201af2
Enough of the safety dance already 😆
https://m.youtube.com/0a382d63-a93a-4acf-878f-dbcc6d201af2
Oh well
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AjPau5QYtYs
I see you beat me to it.
Tony Romo broadcaster. Not Tony Romo QB
Somewhere Belicheat is smiling.
Omar wrote a piece on taking an OG at 22, kind of a rebuttal against Hyde’S article saying you don’t need one in the 1st. A ZBS doesn’t need a 1st round OG, those that typically go in the first are the road graders.
If we don’t take Lamp RD 1, I’d be more than happy with Dion Dawkins RD 2
Say no to Budda. Size matters
Or so I have been told
5 teams that have OL as their biggest remaining need!
That is not good for a good one lasting to the third round!
only 3 that lost OG as biggest need
That about sums up the top OG’s in the draft!
You are being generous
there is only one OG with a 1st round grade – Lamp
then a few with day 2 grades
Its just not a great draft for OL
a lot of the experts said that months ago
there is probably room to draft one and develop him over time
but Lamp jumps out as the only day 1 starter IMO
I don’t even think the 2nd round guys are day 1 starters
and frankly I think most NFL teams could stand to get a little better at OL
I bet 80% of the NFL drafts OL at some point
I think we have to be careful when it comes down to OL this draft
Lets not draft another BillyTurner/Dallas Thomas out of desperation
Piggy
I think Dawkins, Dion and Johnson, Dorian are good prospects.
Throw in the Elf and it doesn’t look so glum
It would cost us #22 and #54 to trade up to #14 for Foster?
I don’t think I like that to much!
It would cost us #22 and #86 to trade up to #17 if Foster would last that long?
I would almost be OK with that!
We need depth not one great player.
I am not a big fan of trading away picks, but the closer to a solid team you get the more it makes sense to do it. Having said that, i dont believe this is the year we are ready to start doing that, but…. if it happens ill just assume it was the right call.
I dont think those draft calculator things are a good indicator of what it would take, i mean i know it does help put you in a range, but teams make deals all the time that are outside those ranges, sometimes dramatically so. Just about finding the right partner to make the right deal and you just give up what ya have to. Maybe ya throw a player in there in trade too, or maybe you trade a next years pick. Id be open to whatever they feel like is a fair trade, they know better than us what they are trying to accomplish with this years draft, and if they give up a lot then that player must have been worth a lot to them.
You said yourself it helps put you in a range, that’s what it’s supposed to do, that’s it. The actual compensation is based on motivation. When you say we gave up too much to get Carroo, and I say we won based on the charts…that’s what the charts are for.
I wasnt arguing the Caroo trade, i was arguing the thing Wyoming said, where he said we would have to give up aX and Y to move up. Im saying the draft calculator doesnt ffactor in need, so its possible you dont have to give up that much, its also possible you could have to give up a bunch more. No one busts out the calculator when they make the deal, they say, is this guy worth what this guy is asking, and the other side of that is, im going to ask for more than its worth and negotiate down to fair value, or even concede value to get picks. The calculator is not in play when they make the decisions, their own value of the pick to them is.
Carroo was just an example. Wyoming was generalizing, because he can’t know the motivation now. Teams do however look at the calculator when making a trade.
Thats very Delmas, he likes to run his mouth lol. I hate it got him in trouble but that would be like telling a bird to not fly off when a cat is creeping nearby.
I have heard Lamp is in consideration by some teams as an OT, so its possible he would be selected. Not to mention you might have a guy like we did who is ready to move out to OT if/when you get an OG to replace, so its possible other teams are in, or could be in the same spot as us.
If ya get to locked in to one guy at any spot, you are bound to get disappointed.
Trade out of the first this year.
I’m OK with that too, especially since we don’t have our regular 3rd, and need depth more than a stud. I’d like to get a 2nd, 3rd and maybe something else for our 1st.
A team like the Browns has a ton of picks and mihght like to move up
What??? I’m no longer considered an OL guru around here? Well for fuck’s sake. How will I go on!?
***
And for what it’s worth, I scout plenty….and my track record in evaluating OL is pretty good…well, it’s okay…or at least I get a couple right once in a blue moon! Lol
***
It’s not that I dislike Lamp. I just think there’s better value at other positions at #22. I think people are going waaay overboard with how he did against Alabama…at tackle not guard…in somehow using that to inflate his value. And, saying he’s Division 1 talent playing at a small school is just words. It means nothing. The FACT is that he did play at a small school AND he didn’t play against Div 1 talent at guard on a consistent basis. We do not know how he would perform against 310 pound interior linemen instead of 250-70 pound DEs because he didn’t do it from the guard position. Completely different ballgame. Completely different set of tools required. Completely different level of physicality playing inside in the NFL.
***
Will he end up being a good NFL guard? I have no idea…and neither does anybody else. It’s pure speculation. I’m just saying I’d go another route in round 1. 3 months ago it was all about Pocic, and I said he was a second rounder at best. Where’s he being slotted now by the “experts”? Exactly. This shit changes constantly around draft time. I’ll stick with what I see and not buy into the hype.
I think he’s a first round talent, but I don’t want to take him at 22. You mentioned the OL quality isn’t very good this year and he’s part that reason, I don’t agree he’s part of that.
Steve i dont think your getting what im saying, they know the value of the pick and they know what value they put on sitting put and taking the pick vs trading it away, they dont bust out a calculator and go, well ya know we really want this guy but the calculator says……
No they go, we need this guy, there wont be another guy on the board at this position that fits us as well, make the trade, but we can only off this much because other wise it will fuck us for the rest of the draft. The reverse of that is, another team makes us an offer, and we look at it by what we are losing out on if we do it, compared to how it opens up other rounds or getting a couple players over one.
Again, its not a “the calculator says this” decision, its a real world, supply and demand scenario, where the one having the item bases their price on what demand there is for it.
The calculator is used, but it’s just to put things into perspective, they don’t know off hand what every pick is worth. I understand what you’re saying.
we need more picks. I don’t think we want to trade away our picks for one player.
Agreed, but we’re talking about trading down.
I don’t mind that. Pick up a 3rd or 4th to move back a few spots.
I think in general this is the mentality they have, i dont think you have to worry, and if they do trade up its probably for a guy who will make a difference, this year, so it might bother you at first, but wouldnt you be ok with losing a pick or two if you knew ya got the guy who could turn one of the problem units around? Id be ok with it, but yeah at first id probably judge the pick badly.
yea probably. At 22 we should get a decent defensive player in this draft. Trading away our 2nd or 3rd to move up a few spots is dumb IMO. Even for a player like foster. I can see us trading picks to get back into 4th round but I hope we don’t move up in the first.
D says:
April 4, 2017 at 12:57 pm
Steve i dont think your getting what im saying, they know the value of the pick and they know what value they put on sitting put and taking the pick vs trading it away, they dont bust out a calculator and go, well ya know we really want this guy but the calculator says……
No they go, we need this guy, there wont be another guy on the board at this position that fits us as well, make the trade, but we can only off this much because other wise it will fuck us for the rest of the draft. The reverse of that is, another team makes us an offer, and we look at it by what we are losing out on if we do it, compared to how it opens up other rounds or getting a couple players over one.
Again, its not a “the calculator says this” decision, its a real world, supply and demand scenario, where the one having the item bases their price on what demand there is for it.
I think another thing you guys have to keep in mind, we are skeptics, or possible overly optimistic in some peoples views, but these guy know A LOT more about these players than we ever will, they have TEAMS of people who devote their entire careers to evaluating players, so no matter what faith you have in them, you should have more than you have with any one of us here. If they make a trade its because they are informed enough to feel pretty confidant that its the right one. We as fans second guess it all the time, and sometimes we have been right, but for fucks sake, how can we believe we know better than them when the day is done? Its just not logical to believe that.
You’re right we don’t know any better. But I keep going back to Deon FF. I bet not everyone in dolphins org wanted to make that move. But I bet Ireland overrode their opinion. You can have a team of people looking at prospects but 1 person makes the ultimate decision so everyone goes along with it.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they traded down. The problem is that this draft isn’t stacked with great talent in round 1. The issue will be finding a team willing to make it worth our while to trade back because I just don’t see anybody in this draft who will be available at #22 worth giving up multiple picks for. But, all it takes is one team who falls in love with a guy. The real value in this draft is in rounds 2 and 3.
A team, like the browns, could make a move for a QB.
I think trading down early will be fine
I don’t think the falloff in talent between 22-50 is great
and the positions we are looking for: OG, LB, DL and DB are probably decent in the 2nd and 3rd round
I think we might be able to use the 3rd and the 3 5th rounders to trade up from the 3rd or into the 4th round too – and to me that makes sense
we have 7 picks
and really 5 good picks is enough
that 3rd rounder is one of the last picks in the 3rd round
it makes sense to move up from there
albeit I think there is talent in the 4th round
if we trade down from 22
I would not be surprised for a trade up later
we don’t need a ton of picks
we need to hit on out picks
I don’t know how many rookies we had on the final 53 last year
but I’m guessing it was 7 or less
Trade back is not any more palatable this year than trade up. If you use the draft calculator you would have to assume even trading out of the first into the early second (ie the Browns scenario) wouldn’t net us much in return, maybe a mid to early third. You would have to have them want to give up more than the pick value to get anything that really would be better than that, again, this is what im saying, Brown’s with all those picks are in a surplus situation with picks, so its possible we could demand that for them to get out first, but you have to be outside the straight value evaluation to believe it will work.
We would be best staying put and drafting at 22, unless we get a really good value to move up (ie something significantly better than the calculator suggests) or really good value to give up our pick (same deal in reverse). We might also find ourselves in a pick and player scenario, or a pick and a next year pick, but again, still holds if we are giving something up, this year its about maximizing value so we get at least a couple more holes filled, and then next year we are in a better position to target specific guys with trade ups.
BoulderPhinfan says:
April 4, 2017 at 1:07 pm
You’re right we don’t know any better. But I keep going back to Deon FF. I bet not everyone in dolphins org wanted to make that move. But I bet Ireland overrode their opinion. You can have a team of people looking at prospects but 1 person makes the ultimate decision so everyone goes along with it.
————————————-
Its the failures of our past that make it hard for us to trust them getting things right, hell im still pretty damn skeptical myself, but i just keep telling myself, its their job to do this and do it well, and last year gave me just enough of a taste of success to grant a reprieve from early judgement.
A small school guard I like in the late second…maybe early third is Taylor Moton. I think he’s probably, naturally, a better fit in a power running scheme, but he has enough athleticism to play in a ZBS. Smart, big, consistent guy who plays every snap, and he even has some experience playing RT.
I don’t know?
But unless someone slides “down” to #22. What is supposed to be there now is kind of “blah” to me?
Not one little bit of excitement!
Even with DJFF I was thrilled until they said Deon instead of Fisher!
JMHFO
Boulder,
That’s true. You never know. Cleveland could do just about anything with all those picks.
So what are you guys expecting in a trade back scenario. Again, i dont really believe in the calculator as the rule, but this is what it says. Trading back from 22 to the Browns would give us a early third rounder in value. Would you trade all the way out of the first for a 3rd in return? Also considering the Browns 3rd is significantly higher value that the 78th pick we would be due, that would mean they would have to package a couple of picks, like their 4th, and a couple of their 5ths. So again, out of the first, and in return we get a 4th and couple of 5ths or maybe ever a 4th and a next years 4th.
To the Browns first second, i meant.
My expectations are simple
I just want to dance!
Randy i like him ok. Physically he reminds me a lot of Tunsil, minus the elite feet. They physically look a lot alit too, i met Moton at Senior Bowl. I wasnt impressed with his personality, but again, those guys are like caged animals at that even having to meet and gett so many people, and expected to talk and sign all that shit, so ill give him a pass for it. Still as a player he seems pretty solid, probably at least worth a look in third, there are other OG’s id like better than him in the second though.
D,
I think he’s pretty similar to Pocic(if seen as a guard), Dawkins or Feeney as far as value. As I’ve said before, I don’t like any of these guards a lot. I wouldn’t take him at the top of the second round, but I might at the end. His value point is probably more top of the third though.
The Browns can probably get a QB like Mitch Trubisky with their #12 pick after using their #1 on DE Myles Garrett.
Boulder, I just read something the other day that recapped who everyone in the org wanted in the 1st rd in the 2013 Draft. Most including Ross liked Tavon Austin and Ireland and Philbin both liked Jordan. If I can find the article I’ll post it.
Woulda been a miss with either of those guys. I still dont know how Ansah wasnt the top on their list, they were said to really like him after Senior Bowl, and then there were the Lane Johnson rumors too.
Have to keep in mind that Gase brought back Stills in this offense, and he expects his QB to be upright. We can say this guy isn’t worth this or that, but when Lamp is there at #22, and if that’s the guy we like best, we’re going to take him. I don’t think we’re done with this OL, and honestly, I think we all better hope we’re not!
Lots of people viewed Jordan as a top 3-5 pick that year. It wasn’t a “crazy” pick by Ireland given how most valued Jordan. It just didn’t pan out. Ireland is a Parcellian. He always valued DE very highly.
I remember being pretty shocked by the Jordan pick, i didnt have Jordan as high as Ansah as a pass rusher. I was hoping Ansah when they announced the trade, but somewhat expecting Johnson.
Jordan was a top pick though, and the trade value was good. Unfortunately the scouting wasnt, but there are some things you will miss in scouting. Odd that the thing they missed on was what Ireland prided himself on, rooting out character concerns.
Agreed. It’s real easy to bash the pick now and the trade was not crazy. Jordan was the fuck up nobody else.
I’m more of the opinion that we need impact talent, not depth. We have a good amount of depth but need some more impact at a few positions.
Any DE we take won’t be starting, but a LB or OG would be
I think we could see a few different guys rotating in year 1. I doubt they start the season opener, but i could even see a few of them becoming the more primary DE in the rotation before years end. Just would really depend on their progress, a few of them are surly capable of that though.
I’d prefer a guy who is ready to play his way into the rotation. I don’t care who starts on the DL, they rotate anyway. I’d prefer a better player than say Fede and some of the other guys we have at the bottom of the depth chart. Let them remain last resorts and upgrade the rotation.
I just cant see any scenario where a guy we have to have pretty high on our board wont be there are 22, so i think outside of just getting a really good offer, we do anything but stay put and make a selection.
Agreed. I do think we could trade up into the 2nd and/or 3rd though. I have said before I would not be surprised if come away with only 4-5 picks but guys we feel real good about.
Not sure what you just said. Are you saying we’re definitely trading either up or back?
Stay put at #22.
Lol Mike, you were all over that, did you change you pick up the wring pair of glasses at work
I won’t be surprised at all if Larsen starts the year at guard for us. He may well not end the year starting, but he could easily begin the year as a starter. I’d prefer better talent there, but Larsen is a veteran, a proven commodity, and a guy I’m guessing Gase knows and feels comfortable with since they went out and signed him. Consistency and not screwing up is sometimes more valuable than a ton of talent but very inconsistent or the coach not being able to trust you.
Yeah i expect Larsen to start unless whatever guy they draft just really shows up day 1 and knocks it out of the park. There is 0 way they can be prepared for the speed of the game change, so most rookies need some adjustment time. If you have a good option, its better than they not learn on the field until they have at least progressed enough to show it wouldn’t be a complete thrown to the wolves situation. Hell, Tunsil who was to me one of the most natural looking prospects i have seen in a very long while on the OL, took some beatings early, and they even said at one time they were not 100% he would be starting. If we didnt have the colossal fuck up twins in Turner and Thomas, i doubt he would have either.
I think you take Moton over maybe some of the other pure OG’s or hybrid OC/OG’s if you are looking at possibility of having them move out to RT if James doesnt re-sign and they elect not to do the 5th year on him. Pocic, Elflien if you want Pouncey health backup insurance.
We also have 3 guys who can play center and I think that’s part of the plan.
4, 3 who can play if Pouncey goes down.
Mike E. says:
April 4, 2017 at 2:11 pm
Not sure what you just said. Are you saying we’re definitely trading either up or back?
———————————–
I was saying we probably stay put and draft at our position, unless we just get a really good offer, and i mean that in either direction. I think they would take a trade up if the value was there, but i also feel they know they dont have to and they will still get someone they really like. I was more referring to trade back scenarios though, as in they wont trade back unless they know what they are getting is an incredibly good deal.
Most likely though, we stay put.
OK, that’s what I was expecting for us as well. I think we can get an impact player at #22, and I think you can get impact players later on too.
If we came away with this in the draft:
DL – is part of the rotation
LB – gets some snaps and a projected future starter
CB – plenty of nickel/dime snaps
OG – projected starter
I’d be fine with it.
I just want to dance
Go for it! LOL
I’m exhausted now….
We added some new starters or significant role players in FA, we’re getting some key guys back and have quite a few young players looking to take the next step. I don’t see this team as having a big void of talent. I see it as needing upgraded talent in some areas, like we’ve all talked about.
I think we’re already better now than we were last year this time and the schedule doesn’t scare me. Year to year good teams have an off year (see Carolina) and sub par teams make a big jump (see Atlanta). Two perfect examples of total opposite seasons within 2 years.
I think we can be this year’s ATL. Hopefully the same situation and Gase says give Ajayi the fucking ball. LOL
Will Drake be our version of Tevin Coleman?
I hope his role on offense increases quite a bit. I know that’s the plan, Gase has said as much. It’s up to Drake to improve his overall game. The playmaking ability is there, we’ve seen it.
I think Drakes role goes us a lot if he just starts to “get it”. Gase in one interview recently basically said Drake kinda frustrated him by doing some rookie type stuff. He admitted he did some really great stuff but then would turn up a little boneheaded on a few plays. IMO this says nothing more than Drake was what he was, a rookie, and that Gase wants to make sure he cleans up his play a little before committing more to him. I think that means we can expect him to, at the very least, have more time on the field. I think that that, along with the lowest tender designation of Williams means that those times where Williams got his snaps, probably start going to Drake instead, with Williams taking a more specialized, but limited role.
goes up
The guy im worried about right now is GrANT man. He was somewhat limited level of use , though i do think Gase was showing through the latter part he wants to try him out in a more offensively expanded role, but he just couldnt stop getting in his own way. The kid’s passion and enthusiasm is contagious and you want to pull for him, but if he hasn’t cleaned some of that up, the role he played could easily be filled by someone else. I half way think he might have been a potential Stills replacement, with Caroo being a Landry replacement, meaning “as in case of we cant keep them” type of replacement. Neither of those picks really hit last year, so i think both of them are going to get the, put your best foot forward this year speech. Grant, possibly with a stronger push to make it happen before 53 cut down.
Greg Auman
✔
@gregauman
Lakewood and UCF cornerback Shaquill Griffin had his first visit today with Dolphins …
—————————————–
I think me and a few others here have talked about this guy as a potential middle rounder at CB. I think there is potential there, he may even be a day 2 kinda guy. Id take him for sure in the 5th, possibly with a 3rd, but i think there will be other guys i like better still there in the 3rd.
Looks like they are also bringing in another guy i really like Deatrich Wise Jr.
D, I think it’s too early to worry about Grant just yet. He was a 6th rd super small speedster and project who made some impact. A PR for a TD and another one called back due to penalty. Struggled handling some punts and was very limited on offense. Same as Drake, mostly STs and a taste of offense. I see both being given an opportunity to do more on offense while still playing on STs in their 2nd seasons. We’ll see how they respond.
One thing for sure is we have a lot of explosive players on offense. More than I can even remember. LOL
Game I want to see Thomas tear it up, then game 2 Parker, 3 Ajayi, 4 Landry and Grant, 5 Carroo and Drake…point being I want a different star every week, so when we face NE they won’t have a clue who to take away.
I think that’s the plan and what Gase wants. He’s an offensive guy, that’s the last place he wants to see his team fail. Overwhelm teams with multiple playmakers.
Ajayi, Landry, Stills, Parker, Thomas, Drake, Williams, Carroo, Grant and maybe someone else. We’ve seen all of them get it done at different levels. Now make sure you feel good about the OL going in.
This is more the song and dance routine i would expect from Piggy
but he is wearing pants
I’m not worried about Grant at all, much more worried about LC3. lol
Only worry when he has to play. 🙂
I get what your saying, that Caroo needs to work out more, but i really like Grant. I guess it more a personal hope that he sticks than it is me feeling a huge loss if he doesn’t make it.
LOL Tim – I think I’m even more worried that he may never have to, but not in a good way for us.
Ajayi, Landry, Thomas, Stills and Parker should be our main offensive weapons with Drake/Williams, Carroo and Grant etc. being role players and next man up. Not all teams have 5 go-to-guys. I think fans and media underrate what we have at the skill positions.
All 5 could be on the field at any time. Okay cover it? LBs and S’s are gonna have a tough time. Too much speed and ability.
If we block it we’ll score at will. Yes… even with Tannehill. 😉
Lol, all 5 could be on the field at any time. They’re the starters, so…
Man, there are two songs that will just wreck your day if you listen to them. That Johnny Cash remake of Hurt, and Tears in Heaven…. painful. Should not have clicked that link of most emotion provoking songs of all time.
I see bust written all over Budda Baker.
He tackles ok, but doesn’t track real well, kind of lays back and waits for the play to come to him, unless he gets an early read, which are the plays you see in his highlight reel. He’ll make the big play, but when he’s not making it he’s a liability.
You’ll never see me say something so negative in my Wedge reports
but I do think there is an argument to be made that Baker amounts to a relatively average safety. I don’t see him a bust but I can see him struggling in the NFL or being relatively average
conversely I think he has a ton of talent and is a really smart football player. I tend to favor smart football players like Baker.
steve
I tend to agree. I think Baker is almost a niche safety, and I’m not sure he’ll even be able to hold up physically in the NFL.
I still think Dante Barnett of K State is one of the most over looked safety prospects in this draft. If there’s a guy out there who would compliment Jones perfectly it’s him.
Steve, you will see Fasano on the field and one less WR at times or no Thomas. Just saying! But those 5 will be a lot to handle for opposing teams. 🙂
Lol
Yeah, I expect to see some heavy run formations too, but that’s not the point.
Lou,
I don’t know a ton about Dante Barnett. I have read some stuff about him…mostly that he’s a good leader and knows how to get people in the right spots, from memory. I have never seen him play that I recall. I’ve always valued having a really good player at deep safety…or whatever deep safety is in the NFL nowadays. Do you think he is a potential top flight safety or more of a solid pro sort of guy?
I’ll answer you and Mike. I don’t look at a lot of mocks. I only look at CBSSports.com rankings and they’ve got him going undrafted. I don’t believe that’s what will happen because he’s one of the better safety prospects out there.
He can play deep or in the box. Versatile. Very good in run support, a playmaker, and very good at center field. So, he’s got that versatility the team likes in safeties.
Personally, and it’s only my opinion, when I look at the others guys who are projected to go higher than him, like Evans and Jones, I just don’t get it because he’s one of those guys who is all over the field. If there’s a guy I can think of he reminds me of it’s Kenny Vaccaro.
Do I think he’ll get drafted? Yes, and I think it’s a lot higher than what most have him projected at.
Lou
Do you think Barnett gets drafted?