Dolphins 2018 – Who do we re-sign, cut or restructure?

San Francisco 49ers v Miami Dolphins

WR Jarvis Landry

I keep seeing things like “He’s going to cost too much, we shouldn’t pay him more than $10M per year” and many sentiments similar to that.  I have to say, I completely disagree.  We finally got a draft pick right.  Landry performed from the word go.  No need for patience with the rookie, give him a few years to develop, he’s still learning, maybe he doesn’t practice well, blah blah blah.  Hell no, this kid had it from the start, and never stopped.  400 receptions in 4 years.  Is that not production?  Some will point to the fact that his YPC average is really low.  Ya think!!  Is it his fault he catches most of his passes near the LOS?  He’s doing what he’s being asked to do.  He was targeted 570 times!  Is there another player on this team we want to target that much?  Is there another player on this team that will be on the field enough to get that many targets?  The guy catches just about everything thrown to him, and the biggest knock on the kid is that he doesn’t score TD’s.  Well, this year he scored 9 TD’s, which is truly elite.  Only  WR’s DeAndre Hopkins and Davante Adams at 13 and 10 respectively, and TE Jimmy Graham TE, who also had 10 TD’s caught more TD’s than Landry.

Landry scoring 9 TD’s is pretty remarkable, because this kid scores TD’s differently than Kenny Stills, who is usually wide open because he blew past the DB.  Landry will catch the ball on a screen, or over the middle, and have to tear through, around and over a bunch of defenders most of his trips to the end zone.  He’s relentless after the catch, he fights tooth and nail for every yard.   Is he perfect?  His enthusiasm and competitiveness sometimes get the best of him.  You know what?  I’ll take a player like that over a guy who just goes through the motions and collects paychecks every day of the week.  Like I said, we finally NAILED a draft pick, and it’s hilarious that I hated the pick from the beginning.  Chalk that up to my ignorance of what kind of player Landry is.  He’s an emotional player, a leader by example, and I love the way he plays the game.  Yes, he needs to cut down on penalties, but again, fiery competitors walk that fine line, but possibly as he matures, he can tame his bad decisions.  I think we have to sign Landry, it would be a damn shame to let a guy that has actually produced, and produced in spades for our team, when we have so many that haven’t done 1/2 of what Landry has done, and that’s the real problem.  It’s not paying a lot of money for the guys who deserve it, it’s paying a lot of money, or maybe even average money for guys who don’t.  He’s not the problem, Landry is part of the solution.  If you feel like we can’t cut Suh, then you have to feel like we must re-sign Jarvis Landry.  Of course, it’s going to come down to $$$, as it always does, and be a combination of how much Miami is willing to allocate to the WR position and a slot receiver, and how much Jarvis Landry is willing to work with Miami and compromise, and how much another team is willing to fork over for one of the most productive WR’s in the game.  RE-SIGN

RT Ja’Wuan James

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I remember the 2014 NFL draft very well.  Dennis Hickey (The Silver Fox) was our GM, and man, we needed help on the O-line, because we always need help on the O-line.  This pick I had nailed down right for once in my life.  Many experts said Ja’Wuan James was a 2nd RD pick, but I knew when #19 rolled around, we were taking James.  His first season in 2014 was pretty impressive.  In case you forgot, James was our starting RT from Game 1, until LT Branden Albert went down for the year with a knee injury, and James slid over to the LT spot for the rest of the season, and amazingly, did so with great success.  As you all know, it’s not an easy task to ask any player to switch sides on the O-line, especially OT’s, and James was a rookie.  The knock on James, and it’s legitimate, is that he has played only 2 full seasons, his rookie season in ’14, and again in ’16, but James missed 9 games in 2015 with a toe injury, and then a hamstring injury this past season forced him to miss 8 games.

To further complicate the issue, the Dolphins had picked up James’ 5th year option last year, and it’s a somewhat hefty price tag.   Not outrageous for a quality OT, which I believe James is, but you can’t call him a durable one.  James is owed $9.34M next season, but if they cut him before June, they don’t take any cap hit at all.  If they cut him past June, Miami would absorb his full salary towards the cap.  It won’t be an easy decision, but like Landry, I think we got this one right.  James is a good, not great OT, but when he’s healthy, he’s a guy that you set and forget. Personally, I hope they rip up that contract, and sign him to a new deal that’s more cap friendly, because I’d hate to let go of our own players, especially young talented players.  You know how Dolphins fans lament that we have no one on the roster for far too many draft classes when Jeff Ireland was here, so why work towards that end?  RE-SIGN

OC Mike Pouncey

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It’s hard to think of letting a Pro Bowl caliber OL go from a team that is struggling to piece together a solid O-line in what seems like an annual ritual for the last decade or so.  In fact, Mike Pouncey, he of the well documented degenerative hip issue, 3 hip surgeries behind him, played a full season, all 16 games in 2017.  The level of how he played is a mixed bag of opinions.  In general, commentators tend to go by reputation, so whenever Pouncey is referred to during a game, it’s usually garnished with past accolades, and rarely do they shine a negative light on the former Pro Bowler.  Fans, however, at least some of them feel like Pouncey is a shell of what he was, and to further elaborate, some felt he was a “soft” player from the start, and a guy who never matched up well with bigger, stronger interior defenders.  Then you have Head Coach Adam Gase, who is effusive with praise for Pouncey, and obviously, what he thinks is paramount, especially compared to us know-it-all fans, and know-it-all beat writers.

It seems to me that Gase will be making that decision for us, and it will most likely be not cutting Mike Pouncey, despite the fact that Pouncey is owed $9M next season, and only $2M of it would be the dead cap hit if we cut him.  Like our resident O-line expert Randy says, Pouncey will be back, it’s too much to expect a high level of play from a rookie OC, and therefore, he will be back.  NO CUT

OLB Lawrence Timmons

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Mr. AWOL is almost certainly going to be a FA in 2018, and I wouldn’t be surprised in the least if Timmons goes back to his former team of 10 seasons, the Pittsburgh Steelers.  Due to the fact that Timmons was suspended by the club for violating team rules, the guaranteed aspect of the 2nd year of his contract was voided, meaning  the $7.25M salary that Timmons would be commanding, and more importantly, the the $8.225M that would have been a dead cap hit if we cut him is now off the books.  Timmons had an uneven season, and the youth movement at LB is real, Raekwon McMillan, Stephone Anthony, Chase Allen,  and even Kiko Alonso is only 26, so I’m afraid it’s clear The Dolphins will bid adieu to Mr. Timmons.  CUT

QB Ryan Tannehill

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This is a strange set of circumstances for Tannehill in 2018.  Tannehill went down with a knee injury in game 13 of the 2016 season.  He elected at the time to not have surgery to repair the partially torn ACL ligament, and sprained MCL in his left knee.  He decided rehabbing, and strengthening the muscle surrounding the knee would suffice, and that decision backfired on both he and the Dolphins this season, when Tannehill collapsed in a heap in a non-contact play in a practice on August 3rd,  as he scrambled towards the right sideline.  This time, the partially torn ligament was now completely torn, and reconstructive surgery was a necessity, not just an option.  So on August 17th 2017, Tannehill had the surgery, and the latest reports were that Tannehill is already running (in a straight line).  That’s good news, but should the Dolphins be cautious and not put all their eggs into one basket, hoping that Ryan Tannehill will be healthy enough to play similar to the QB that played to 100+ QB rating from game 6 to the game he was injured in in week 13, an 8 game stretch?

That’s the conundrum the Dolphins face.  Ryan Tannehill could do what Tom Brady has done for years, help his team “cook the books” and help the Dolphins out of a shortage of cap money, considering he currently will be making $19.8M in 2017, but the Dolphins do have an escape hatch, as he only carries a $4.6M dead cap hit.  Will Tannehill be willing to restructure his deal, and will the Dolphins ask him to?  Will the Dolphins, who choose at #11 in the 2018 draft find his replacement there, or possibly in RD 2 at pick #42?  Let’s say just for fun, the Dolphins take a QB either at #11, or #42, what do we with Ryan Tannehill?  Does Tannehill start in ’18, and let the rookie sit and learn for a season, or do we look to trade Tannehill?  I think trading Tannehill could only be done after extensive exposure, meaning getting through training camp, and the preseason looking fresh, and athletic, playing well, and not showing any signs of favoring his knee, or looking less nimble.  After all, who would trade for a QB coming off an injury without knowing he was healthy and capable?

I think Ryan Tannehill will be our QB in 2018, and if he’s healthy and plays well, for years after that too.  I think Gase believes in Ryan, and I think Ryan believes with Gase, he can play his best football.  Regardless, if Ryan can help us by redoing his contract to make it more cap friendly, I think he should do it, and I believe he would do it.  At least I hope so.  RESTRUCTURE

TE Julius Thomas

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If you’re a regular reader here, you know well how badly I crave a top talent at the TE position for our team.  After watching Julius Thomas toil for one season in 2017 here with Miami, it’s clear he’s not part of that conversation. Thomas is due a hefty $6.5M next season, but Miami can cut him and only suffer a $2M dead cap hit.  While he wasn’t exactly awful, he was so far from being an effective receiver that threatened the seam, and terrorized LB’s and safeties.  He was as pedestrian as possible, finishing with 41 receptions for 388 yards and 3 TD’s, with 9.46YPR.  That’s fine for a 2nd TE, if he could block, but Thomas just can’t do that, so this one is easy enough for me not to waste much time or space on.  One caveat, he is one of Gase’s guys, but nonetheless, it’s time to say BYE-BYE.  CUT

WR Leonte Carroo

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Take a good look at this picture, because I’m sure many of you, like myself, don’t even know what Leonte Carroo looks like, or what number he wears, or whether he can run a concise route tree, or catch a 50/50 ball, because we rarely see this guy on game day. So, Leonte Carroo III (as I call him), not because he’s the 3rd generation Leonte Carroo, but jokingly, like his predecessor,  RB Daniel Thomas , otherwise know as DT3, because it took 3 picks to acquire both of these rare, yet seldom used talents.  OK, enough of the dripping sarcasm, but really, what’s the deal with this guy?  The front office, hopefully along with HC Adam Gase went great guns after him, trading back into the 3rd RD of the 2016 NFL Draft and forfeiting additional picks in the 3rd and 4th RD of the 2017 NFL draft, so they must have felt pretty strong that he would be an impact player for our offense.  After 2 seasons, the story tells otherwise, with Carroo reeling in a total of 10 receptions, not yet eclipsing 100 yards, and 1 TD.

Carroo has 2 years remaining on his contract, and because he was a 3rd RD pick, it’s pretty inexpensive at $826K this season, and $916K in 2019, and then he is an URFA in 2020.  Logic says he will be on the roster to see if he can be more than he has, but the fact that he was surpassed already by fellow WR Jakeem Grant, who was a 6th RD pick in 2016 doesn’t bode well for Carroo.  I do think Carroo will have to make strides in ’18, he’s not going to be kept around here if he doesn’t show any signs that he can be more than what he’s been, which is simply disappointing.  NO CUT  (At least until after the preseason)

DE William Hayes

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William Hayes was stopped in a Turkish Airport with 4 pounds of hashish in 1970.  The movie Midnight Express depicts the entire story, although according to Hayes, Director Oliver Stone embellished quite a bit, and much to Hayes dismay, portrayed the Turkish people, and justice system unfairly.  Oh, wait, not that William Hayes, I meant the free agent DE who played for the Dolphins!  Hayes was excellent in the DL rotation, and as he was in his entire career, with the Titans and the Rams, he was excellent run defender and edge setter.  His stats last year don’t jump off the page, but Hayes is a very good player that the Dolphins should bring back.

Hayes played in 10 games for the Dolphins, before being put on IR with a back injury.  Hayes is a strong veteran presence that our young DL can learn from.  I think the odds are pretty good that we draft a DE somewhere in this draft, and Hayes would be a great mentor, and someone to learn from.  Hayes will be 33 next season, so I would expect another 1 YR contract for him if we sign him. Thanks M!   RE-SIGN

 

 

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567 Responses to Dolphins 2018 – Who do we re-sign, cut or restructure?

  1. wyoming85 says:

    • stangerx says:

      Certainly seems the sides aren’t getting along. Neither Landry or his agent are happy (and dude goes on an in-depth rampage). Mostly about what Mando wrote from “sources” but guessing he like we know Mando is the FO go to guy.

  2. son of a son of a shula says:

    They better fix this shit with Landry. I’m tired of seeing guys who we had on our team playing for different teams especially teams in the playoffs. Landry isn’t setting records because he’s a replaceable player, he’s at a higher level than most and he’s here. Sign Landry and don’t screw it up.

  3. son of a son of a shula says:

    Wyo every one of your 25 drafts ( and that’s just today lol) has one thing in common:
    Dmitri Flowers, he’d be a nice player to have.

    • The Flying Pig says:

      Imagine running an offense with a Fullback

      Dolfans will be so confused when they see an I formation…”what’s with all those guys behind the QB, is that legal?”

  4. The Flying Pig says:

    Honestly I don’t think 14.5 per year is too much to ask for Landry

    Antonio Brown gets 17m
    Hopkins 16.2

    Landry has 400 catches in 4 years

    • there’s no comparing Landry to Brown and it’s a known fact that the more passes Landry catches the less games we win. Landry may have been valuable from the point of view that he was used as much as he was in his first four years but one could say it was almost to the detriment of the team.

      We did not win more games when Jarvis was used more; we won less. The team does not have a complete offense and if we had one where we had the ability to utilize the talent on the offense properly in order to score more, Landry probably becomes less valuable in the offense than he does more valuable.

      People keep talking about what he’d do with the Pats being part of their offense and he wouldn’t be as valuable on the Pats offense because 1. they spread the ball around A LOT. they use a lot of different weapons on their offense; not targeting one guy and the TE is a huge part of their offense. Gronkowski lead all receivers with just 69 receptions so if you think Jarvis is headed for NE you’ve got another thing coming. He’s not getting paid there to catch 130 balls a year.

      • Mike E. says:

        Whoa now, that doesn’t diminish his production or value though. Juts because we threw him the ball too much doesn’t make him ineffective. It makes the rest of our garbage WR corps look that way. Why isn’t anyone else getting open, or coming back to the QB to help, or inspiring confidence in the QB? It’s not just Tannehill either, it’s all of them!

      • Okay, so let’s say we pay him $14M a year and then we go with two TE’s and start utilizing them and the rb’s more in the passing game like NE. We also are able to get Stills more involved because of an improvement in the offensive line resulting in better pass protection.

        Landry’s numbers fall off over the next two years and then everyone starts saying, “gee, these idiots just spent $14m/yr on a guy who’s production is way down over the past two years and we’re winning more games than we were before”.

        Just because the offense as a whole wasn’t clicking like it should doesn’t make him more valuable in and of itself. Yeah, we didn’t have a ton of talent on the offensive side. But, if we have the talent there and the deal is we spread the ball around to multiple weapons on offense a guy like Jarvis isn’t going to get 400 receptions in 4 yrs.
        It’s going to be a lot less.

      • The Flying Pig says:

        It’s 3M less than Brown Lou

        You can compare them all you want. I do. Reasonably most people would conclude Brown is better and should get paid higher. That’s the point. One is 14.5 and the other is 17m

        Edelman caught 105 passes in ‘13 and 98 in ‘16. They’ve had plenty of high catch guys over the years Chris Hogan had 79 in ‘16. And welker…do we really need to get into that…

      • And Brown is a hell of a lot more valuable to Pittsburgh.

      • The Flying Pig says:

        3M is a hell of a lot of money

  5. Who here thinks Chris Grier is the GM?

    • Mike E. says:

      I know he holds the title, but how much that actually means, I don’t know, and will probably never know. I can’t help myself, I’m always skeptical of TBomb.

  6. son of a son of a shula says:

    If Landry was free agent we could get we’d give him the sun moon and stars but since he’s our own he’ll get jerked around and fucked around til gets pissed and leaves and we get to watch him win Super Bowls weeeeee

    • Mike E. says:

      They better not fuck this up. I think we’ll get it done, but the Dolphins better be careful not to fuck with him too much.

  7. wyoming85 says:

    Flowers scored 9 TD’s this year!

  8. Mike E. says:

    Lou

    My point is that Jarvis DID put up those numbers, and whether he should have been targeted as much isn’t in question, it’s that he was, and and that he came through when called on. No one else in our WR corps, TE’s or anywhere contributed as much as Landry. He’s a very good player, and we shouldn’t let him go. Maybe if we start adding some talent around here, maybe a TE that can run and catch, and maybe Parker is finally healthy, or we replace him with someone else that can get the job done, Landry’s receptions would go down, but his TD total would be close, and his YPR avg will go up.

    • Yeah, he put those numbers up. Okay, we targeted him more than any other player on the offense but what did it get us? Does targeting Landry more make the offense better? Does it open things up for other players on the team?

      Piggy brought up Brown for Pitt. Look at his receptions over the past 4 years, his yds and his td’s. No comparison. And when Brown is catching the ball there’s always a possibility there’s going to be a score. Not so with Landry. Yeah, we’re comparing a guy on the outside with a slot but that’s the point.

      We weren’t winning more or having more of a shot to win the more we got him the ball because he’s not a threat. Defenses don’t give a shit if you’re throwing to a slot wr short of the first down marker and if we get the offense straightened out and we are able to do what we want on offense then his value to the offense is going to go down.

  9. Mike E. says:

    Brown is arguably the best WR in football, but he also plays for a team with a better QB, RB and O-line than we have.

    • Mike E. says:

      And the other WR’s they have are probably better than anyone else we have too

    • true, they have all that and that’s what I’m saying. Jarvis is valuable to Miami because they ain’t got shit. fix the offensive line and get some running game going. get Drake and Williams involved a bit more with the passing game, and if we’ve got TE’s we could use in the passing game you use them, spreading the ball around to multiple targets and Jarvis doesn’t become nearly as important to the team as he once was.

      IF, and I only say IF, the team were to get to that point and that’s what Gase is looking at then why do you pay one guy who isn’t going to be the deciding factor in too many games that kind of money?

      • Mike E. says:

        No Lou, Jarvis is valuable because he’s really good. He’ll still be valuable when we have better players around him.

      • think about this. think about how many times we target Landry. think about how many catches he has in a game. how much did that help the offense? did it open things up for other receivers? did it open up the run game? did the offense do better the more he was targeted or worse? did we win more games when he caught more passes or did we lose more games?

        Jarvis is good. He doesn’t miss games due to injury. He’s reliable. But he’s not a difference maker.

  10. Is losing Landry in free agency really the end of the world? Is it really that big of a deal? Anyone is replaceable and that includes Landry.

    • Mike E. says:

      Yes, every player is replaceable, but why let a guy who we drafted, and produced to pro bowl level walk? Especially considering what else we have, why let him go?

      • the Steelers let an OC walk when the team had the 8th highest scoring offense in the league in ’17 and just put up 42 pts on one of the best defenses around.

        I’ll be honest with you. I can really care less if Landry stays or goes. It’s not the end of the world.

  11. Mike E. says:

    Lou – Think of it this way, forget the draft and FA, are we a better team with Landry or without him?

  12. Tim Knight says:

    As much as I like Landry, I agree with Lou it’s not the end of the world. Maybe Gase doesn’t want the offense going through Landry and we’re dialing up something different with the new coaches. Gase hasn’t been happy with the offense since he’s been here and maybe he wants to change things. If Landry wasn’t looking for as much money as he is it would probably be easy to sign him but you have to admit it’s a lot of money for what he does. I’ve been going back and forth on it myself all season if he’s worth it or not. We’ll see. Other teams win without Landry and we can too. WR is the most abundant position to find so there’s that.

  13. Ken says:

    I would keep Landry over Suh

    • Tim Knight says:

      That’s not an option. LOL

      Based on what you’ve been saying about Suh not making a great impact or making players around him better, does Landry do that? I’d say other than a lot of catches, no.

      • Ken says:

        He led the NFL in receptions and scored 9 TDs all with a terrible QB and terrible OL and a running game that didn’t really show up until the last 5 games so I think the answer is he does make others and or the team better

      • Tim Knight says:

        But Ken, we all know where he gets those catches. Other then on 3rd down and manageable, does he really scare opposing defenses?

        This isn’t meant to demean Landry, but he doesn’t take over games. Look at the stats below – his 20+, YPG and 1st downs. Is that top dollar type stuff?

  14. Tim Knight says:

    It looks like Landry could get the transition tag to test if the market for him is real with the numbers he’s seeking.

  15. Mike E. says:

    Maybe on a team that has drafted well, and has better options, do you maybe let Landry walk. Teams that have talent from drafts over the last 5-10 years can do that. We’re not one of those teams, not even close. We’re just starting to finally get things right, we have a small corps of good young players, and Landry is maybe the best of all of them. It would just disgust me to subtract him because we won’t pay him for what he’s done. I’d sooner cut Stills and pay Landry, because I think he’s more easily replaced that Landry is, and we already paid Stills. Yes, it’s not what Landry will get, but I think Landry is a better WR than Stills is. Landry is also on the return team, which gives him additional value.

    • Tim Knight says:

      Landry has value, but how much? If the team can make it work with only having about $10M under the cap as of now, go for it. But I’m not sure the production = what he’s looking for. 8.8 YPCA is not a good number for a WR and people say well that’s how we use him and that’s true. That’s also why he had 112 catches. I’m not against re-signing Landry, but I also don’t think he’s a no-brainer at his number.

  16. mf13ss says:

    Ken says:
    January 17, 2018 at 6:17 pm
    He led the NFL in receptions and scored 9 TDs all with a terrible QB and terrible OL and a running game that didn’t really show up until the last 5 games so I think the answer is he does make others and or the team better
    ———–
    That terrible QB and terrible O-Line made Jarvis look better than Tannehill ever did.

      • mf13ss says:

        Well then you probably shouldn’t be talking about Jarvis leading the NFL in receptions while catching 9 TDs this past season! LOL

    • Ken says:

      We all know you have an agenda against Tannehill but that’s a pretty ridiculous statement. Landry has been a stud since he was a rookie. In some ways this was his was his worst season especially in YPC which was his career low. Please be objective

      • mf13ss says:

        I actually do NOT have an agenda against Tannehill… many others do, but not me. I’m trying to keep both the TANNEHOMERS and TANNEHATERS grounded in reality… which is QUITE the job! LOL

        I’ve seen guys with a near 20.0 YPC and over 1,000 yards score next to zero TDs. The scoreboard dictates the outcome of a game. You can’t dismiss Jarvis’ 9 TDs by grumbling over his YPC… that’s not fair to anybody on our team.

  17. wyoming85 says:

    • mf13ss says:

      I’ll say this about Josh Allen: if he lands on a team with a running game, he’s going to be NICE! That guy can throw on the run like nobody’s business. He will be absolutely dangerous.

      • The Flying Pig says:

        He’s got a cannon too

        I just think he has accuracy issues

      • mf13ss says:

        Agreed, Pig. Hopefully he will iron out those accuracy issues with some time and coaching. And yes… he’s got a CANNON.

      • Tim Knight says:

        He’d be a guy I’d take a chance on at #11 if he’s there. I don’t think he gets past the Jets though.

  18. wyoming85 says:

  19. Tim Knight says:

    M13, how is Landry the all time leader in receptions his first 4 seasons without Tannehill involved? LOL

    Let’s not act like 9 TDs is 15. He was plenty productive with Tannehill at QB.
    http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/16790/jarvis-landry

    That said, he’s the same player every year with stats tilted this way or that way. We all know who he is as a player.

    • Tim Knight says:

      I’m also not a TANNEHOMER, not sure why we need labels to have an opinion on a guy I think is a quality QB. Okay he’s not elite, most in the league aren’t and they all have ups and downs as we’ve seen. How’s things been going with Luck? The guy could have died.

    • mf13ss says:

      You’re taking me the wrong way when it comes to Tannehill, Bro. My main point is that Cutler didn’t absolutely suck this past season… and he gave Jarvis career-highs in receptions and TDs… all while Cutler came out of retirement, post-shoulder surgery, no familiarity with his new team, cracked ribs, concussion, and behind one of our worst O-Lines in recent memory.

      I’m tired of the narrative that Cutler sucks so badly from the TANNEHOMERS, all in an effort to make Tannehill look better. That’s a failed argument and has nothing to do with anything going forward… it’s a moot point. I heard it ALL season long and it was tired, being I’m always rooting for my team to WIN!

      • Tim Knight says:

        Why are we talking about Cutler, his time is over here? He was a fill-in nothing more. He was really bad early, pretty good for a short stretch, then okay. I don’t think this season was all on him. The circumstances sucked for us in a lot of ways this season.

        Landry had 110 catches in 2015. I’d actually prefer he have 80-90 and not over 100 so we utilize a TE more. We’ll see what happens. I’m not going to lose all hope if we let him walk. LOL

  20. mf13ss says:

    If we re-sign Jarvis at $14M, I believe we’ll be the only team in the league paying 3 players $14M+ (Suh, Tannehill, Jarvis). This is a very difficult position cap situation to be in, quite obviously.

    I want Jarvis back as badly as anyone… we’ll see how it goes.

  21. Tim Knight says:

    One of the things that always pops in my mind about Landry and his bread and butter game is, the Pats find guys from everywhere who can do that including RBs. They just use 3-4 of them, not one. Maybe we don’t feel that’s a #1 WR paid position. I don’t blame the FO for thinking that. I don’t think it is, and we see it can be productive without it.

    I can see an offense with Drake, Williams, a rookie like Samuels, new TE talent, Stills, Parker and Grant working fine. We can exist without Landry.

    • Mike E. says:

      Who’s the go-to-guy when you need to convert a 3rd down?

      • Tim Knight says:

        The open guy. 🙂

        Don’t you want a TE who can be that guy at times? We need to have a better impact at TE as you know. They are 3rd down players.

      • Mike E. says:

        Hell yeah I do, but we haven’t had that guy in over a decade, but all of a sudden now we’re going to find one? I think we can be fine w/o Landry, it just kills me that when we finally kill it on a draft pick, we’re too busy paying other players to keep him. Name the last offensive draft pick who produced like Landry has

  22. Tim Knight says:

    Quickness, speed and big play ability. 3rd year guy showing development and big plays.

  23. wyoming85 says:

  24. Mike E. says:

    Landry is younger than Grant, fully developed. lol

    • Tim Knight says:

      It’s not about Grant replacing Landry, it’s about more speed everywhere. Mike, I’m looking at alternatives, not trying to be the anti-Landry guy. If we bring him back he’s part of the offense. If not, how do we build the offense without him? That’s all.

    • Ken says:

      It’s not Landry or Grant it’s Carroo or Grant

  25. wyoming85 says:

    11) Miami Dolphins: Orlando Brown | OT | R-Jr. | Oklahoma
    From USA Today: “Miami can save $9 million by moving on from Ja’Wuan James at right tackle, and the line was one of several sore spots for the offense this season. The massive Brown (6-8, 345 pounds) can bring a physical tone to an attack that had just four rushing touchdowns.”

    https://247sports.com/Gallery/USA-Today-unveils-initial-2018-NFL-mock-draft-113371709/GallerySlides/819106?ftag=ACQ-07-10aac1c&vndid=1863439868&nan_pid=1863439868&ad_id=7680395

    • Tim Knight says:

      To me OL is more important than Landry. TE too. I think a RB attack out of the backfield in the passing game is coming in 2018. With the coaching changes I see there is more focus on the RBs. Loggains and Studesville are run oriented guys. ORob should be happy. 🙂

      Gase wants to control the ball more than we have. The big plays happen more when you run 70 plays vs. 50 something.

  26. Anyone here like Harold Landry. Seems more like a 3-4 OLB than a 4-3 defensive end.

  27. son of a son of a shula says:

    110 catches a year is under seven a game. We can continue to spread it around and still have Landry get his. Get his with his play making ability, his heart, his leadership and when he’s not catching it he’s probably if not the best blocking receiver in the league. I don’t see how you get better getting rid of some of the best players in the league I don’t get it.

    • Tim Knight says:

      You’re not getting rid of him, it’s the price tag and that matters. I do think we can move on from his production at the price he’s asking with multiple players, not Landry getting a 100+ catches. It really doesn’t add up.

  28. herdfan says:

    I click on here and read comments from time to time….it’s kind of like a soap opera….you can miss weeks and come back and it’s like you haven’t missed a thing…the same conversation….Is there anything new going on? Anyone hired/fired/arrested? Do we still suck?

  29. wyoming85 says:

  30. son of a son of a shula says:

    Out of Suh, Landry and Tannehill it’s Tannehill that’s the odd man out to me. Especially with Baker sitting there.

    • I know it’s going to be odd hearing this from me but, just like they did with Suh putting the cart before the horse, I think it would behoove them to build the team a bit before going out and wasting another first rd pick on a quarterback.

      I’d rather see them take a shot at a talent like Benkert later and if it works out great. But get your guys at least in the first two round to help build this team and maybe add one key free agent who isn’t a stop-gap player.

    • Tim Knight says:

      How we go about QB is going to be interesting this offseason. I think Fales already replaced Moore. Doughty seems to be a good scout team QB and that’s why we keep him around. But we never want to play him. Not sure when but I definitely see us drafting a QB and Ryan already said he gets it.

      RT will be penciled in as the starter in 2018 barring injury setbacks. Gase already said it publicly. He’s not getting cut unless he can’t suit up. LOL

    • The Flying Pig says:

      I agree but I don’t think we are making that choice

      Suh is one of the highest paid defenders
      But Landry (at 14m) and Tannehill are among the highest paid at their positions

  31. The Flying Pig says:

    I would have it look it up but I think maybe the giants and Seahawks have a few high contracts

    Maybe the Steelers too (rothlisberger and Brown)
    Maybe the Bengals (dalton and Green)

    I don’t know about 3 over 14m but it’s probably close

    Honestly I am more concerned with contracts like Pouncey, Alonso and Branch than the higher ones we have

    I kinda think we pay a lot of replaceable guys big money

    • Branch’s contract was only 3yrs $24M. That’s not a lot for a defensive end and it’s a bargain compared to what the Giants paid OV. Plus, I believe Branch was playing with an injury a good portion of the season which limited his effectiveness.

      • Tim Knight says:

        Branch missed games and played hurt most of the 2nd half. Hayes also went on IR, that’s why Harris and Fede played so much. Then Malveaux. We had one of those everything went wrong seasons.

        Back to work!

      • The Flying Pig says:

        Branch’s capnhit in 2018 is 10 million dollars
        His base salary is over 7m and in 2019 it’s just under 7m

        That’s silly money for a guy who has never had over
        6 sacks in his career

        Who cares if he was injured
        Healthy he isn’t worth that money

  32. don’t know if this was posted yet but did anyone see this?:

    Adam Beasley

    Verified account

    @AdamHBeasley
    8h
    8 hours ago

    More
    With all of this Landry drama, here’s a scenario that smart football people see as a real possibility: Jarvis has to take a one-year deal somewhere. Reservations about his hot and cold nature aren’t just in Davie.

    • Tim Knight says:

      That’s why he’ll get the transition tag which can be rescinded at anytime but allows you to test the market and match. No compensation for losing the player though.

  33. Ken says:

    IMO only Rosen, Darnold or Allen are QBs that we should consider at 11. I don’t expect any of them to be there at 11 but if for some strange reason one of them is I get drafting them there. If they are not there I don’t see another QB worthy of a first round pick. Somebody may take Mayfield in the first but I would stay clear.? I do think taking a QB in the mid rounds is a good idea. I like Benkert and Ferguson as possible targets

    • I like Benkert from the point of view that if you feel Tannehill is your guy going forward and you’re not going to need a rookie to come right in Benkert has the tools with the arm, the mobility and he’s a smart quarterback.

      So, you’ve got a great starting point and if you’re worth anything as a quarterback whisperer he’s a guy you should be able to make something out of .

  34. I know it’s a long shot and we did it in the past with the Tuna but do you think Ross should be looking to bring in a guy who’s got more football knowledge at the top rather than this accountant with his law certificate?

    I mean, I don’t know who’s out there and like I said yesterday I don’t think Marino would be the guy but I like what San Fran did with Lynch. Maybe JT. Who knows. But, it’s just something I was thinking about.

    • Ken says:

      Hey there is nothing wrong with a “law certificate “ and it’s called a juris doctorate. LOL. I get what you are saying and actually agree with you to an extent. It’s not so much that we need a football guy as you say but I don’t believe in Tannenbaum. He loves to make big splashy moves and it seems like he puts every team he is involved with in cap Hell

      • I agree with Tannenbaum and the one thing that scares me about him more than anything going into this next season is the “gotta solve every problem” mentality. It can’t be done but, by golly, he’s going to give it his best shot.

        And, IMO, he makes things worse rather than making them better.

  35. Tim Knight says:

    Piggy, Branch is a solid NFL DE at a middle of the road contract who was injured the 2nd half of the season this year. His deal is not something to be frowned upon. You’re getting all crazy. LOL

    • The Flying Pig says:

      He’s average Tim

      And contracts like those will kill us

      • Tim Knight says:

        So is his deal and he was playing really well until he got injured. We forget shit like that when you finish 6-10. It’s that time of year to look at cap, FA and draft and write players off unless it’s emotional. LOL

  36. Ken says:

    I get what Piggy is saying about Branch. He is expendable. His production could easily be replaced and hopefully it will be by Harris and Malveaux

    • Tim Knight says:

      His cap hit is not good this year, next year. Branch was playing well until he got injured. We were 4-2 at one time because of the defense. The offense let us down all season.

  37. The Flying Pig says:

    You guys can try to be positive, indifferent or pragmatic

    But I’m telling you, if we let Landry go the squeals will be like none you’ve ever heard before

    Mountains will rumble
    Skies will darken
    Squigglies with straighten

    Oink will be had
    🐷

  38. Ken says:

    If Branch is a $10 million cap hit in 2018 then I believe he should be and will be gone. He is not terrible but as discussed his production can be replaced for less

  39. The Flying Pig says:

    Kiko’s Cap hit is almost 10m in 2018 too

    His dead money is 13m…😳

    So you can’t cut him

  40. Tim Knight says:

    You know what’s weird, but trading Wake or releasing him at $8.625M with a $3.5M dead cap is feasible. Are we super bowl contenders next year or a playoff appearance type team? Will Wake be here when we’re ready for the big run if ever? LOL

    I love Wake the man and player, he worked his way up through every obstacle avenue you can and has handled himself as a pro all the way. He’ll be 36 this month.

    This team has a lot of decisions to make with personnel. We’ve seen what has happened with coaching and the staff, I expect some more with player personnel. It’s not staying the same that’s for sure.

  41. Tim Knight says:

    You guys are cap crazy right now. LOL

  42. The Flying Pig says:

    Cap crazy

  43. Tim Knight says:

    I’d like to keep our current roster, make a few cuts that helps us add need in FA at 2-3 positions, draft and build on what we have. We don’t need a big FA.

  44. ocalarob says:

    The Flying Pig says:
    January 17, 2018 at 3:38 pm
    Honestly I don’t think 14.5 per year is too much to ask for Landry

    Antonio Brown gets 17m
    Hopkins 16.2

    Landry has 400 catches in 4 years
    ________________________________________

    different rec’s with different skill sets, Brown and hopkins are speed guys who can beat D’s deep, not so with Landry, he’s a Brian Hartline type possession rec, a very good one and may be worth 8 mil per.
    I believe he’s played his last game in Miami, it is very obvious Gase doesn’t want this guy around, . The open sideline argument with Gase, Gase throwing him under the bus publicly for getting ejected. it looks pretty clear to me, Landry’s Ajayi #2.

    It would appear that gase is on a power trip at the expense of the Miami dolphins JMO

  45. ElephantRider says:

    Gase should be on a power trip. Something has got to change…..same players, same results.
    I don’t give a shit anymore about how stays or goes. Doesn’t seem to matter. He’s churning the coaches now too….good!
    Gase has 2 years under his belt. Let’s see what happens here on out.

  46. I don’t know if Harris was drafted to be Wake’s eventual replacement but, if he was, they made a mistake. Harris would have been better off being drafted as a pass rushing OLB in a Denver scheme. I’m not saying he’s going to bust out like Jordan but I don’t know if he’s ever going to get to that same level that was achieved by Wake. That could take several years.

  47. olddolphan says:

    SO LANDRY’s pissed off at T-Bomb??? Aren’t we all?? Of course, T-Bomb’s only doing what Ross tells him to do, right? If Ross thinks this is just another real estate deal he’s dead wrong!!! Speaking of “dead,” well, maybe I better not go there. But Ross needs to know that players have feelings and really good players have PRIDE in what they’ve accomplished. A piece of real estate has NEITHER! I won’t be shocked if Landry says he’s had enough of THE DOOFUS BRIGADE and signs with New England as a free agent.

    Way to go, Little Stevie Blunder!! Your reward is you get to see more season ticket holders head for the exits!!
    ——————-
    MF-13: Thanks for the birthday wishes a couple of days ago. Please continue to enjoy the life benefits brought to you by Martin Luther King.

  48. BoulderPhinfan says:

    shouldn’t Julian Edelman type contract be what Landry gets? I think they’re pretty similar players.

    • Tim Knight says:

      That’s what I said at the start of the season.

      • Tim Knight says:

        Landry is younger so he should get a bit more but that doesn’t seem to be what he’s thinking.

    • D says:

      I dont think you can use any other player’s contract to justify how much another should be paid, or at least not wholly. Edelman’s situation is different, the team offers their players more in incentives to stay with the team and give team friendly contracts than others do because they can line every finger on their hand with Superbowl rings. They can fill both hands with conference championship rings, and they can fill a suitcase with division championship ones. Edelman is also a replaceable piece in that machine, just like Welker was before that, and Amendola so Landry compared to those guys…..there really isnt a comparison. We will have to pay a lot more to keep Landry than they did to keep Edelman. They probably we never in jeopardy of losing Edelman either, whereas we could very likely get outbid on Landry this time around especially if we are offering Edelman type money. Landry is going to cost us some money and we just have to determine if we can afford it. I personally think we can, and i think we should make a sizable offer that represents what kind of value he is to our team. We still have a lot of other moves we can make to clear cap space.

  49. D says:

    If i were setting Landry’s value it be around 12-13mil per, 14-14.5 wouldn’t be outside my consideration though. He has the benefit of a weak WR FA class this year, so he is the top guy and is going to be able to wring a little more out of a team because of it. If we dont pay him 14, im pretty sure there are teams out there that would be willing to.

  50. D says:

    I think Harris was drafted to be a Leo LB, or maybe an OTTO, i havent exactly figured out what Burke is trying to do on that side, but it pairs with a 9-tech DE like what they seem to be trying to do with Wake, even though they seemingly keep only just putting it in some of the time instead of going full force with that scheme. Harris then would essentially be a 3-4OLB, who would be in a 3 point stance some of the time and two pint others, and could essentially be lined up 5,7, or 9 tech and be asked to pass rush or even drop into coverage. It would still be a 4-3 setup, but his role would be a hybrid between a 3-4 OLB, a 4-3 SAM and a 4-3 DE. They had him a few times lined up almost like a 3-4 DE as well.

    I dont really think they were planning on him to replace Wake, or Branch or whatever, i think they were adding pass rushing talent that they though would be useful for the concepts of their defense and probably in more than just a specific limited role, but someone they could use to do a bunch of different things. They seem to really like flexibility in their players.

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