2017 NFL Draft – Defensive Ends

Taco Charlton 6’6” 277 DE Michigan


Taco is going to possibly be one of the DE’s who may be available at #22 in the first RD. He has prototypical size, with long arms (34 1/2”), and has production at a big school. While he didn’t blow up the combine, he ran a pedestrian 4.92 40 and put up 25 reps (with long arms!). Keep in mind that Terrell Suggs ran a 4.84, and he doesn’t “play” slow. Taco played all 4 years at DE for Michigan, and his senior year was his best with 40 tackles (20 solo), 13.5 TFL, and 10 sacks. It should be noted that Taco was basically a special teams player until his Junior year, where he saw more action at DE, but basically, Taco has one full year of starting experience.

NFL.com has Taco rated at 6.5. According to most scouts, the word inconsistent keeps popping up, but a lot of scouts feel if he is in the right program with the right coach, he has potential to be a quality player.

Derek Barnett 6’3” 259 DE Tennessee


Barnett was a 3 YR starter at DE for Tennessee.A consistent pass rusher from the get-go, he had 9 sacks his Freshman season, 10 in his Junior year, and then topped it off with 13 sacks his Senior year. He also added 56 tackles (40 solo), along with 19 TFL, 1 INT, 5 passes defensed, and 2 FF’s. Barnett features very good hand fighting techniques, and that’s his best attribute. Not particularly fast (4.88 40), he does have a quick first step. Not sure if he makes it all the way to #22, but I’d think he’d be given serious consideration if he did. NFL.com has Barnett rated at 6.21

Tim Williams 6’3” 244 LB/DE Alabama


Tim Williams played all 4 years at LB for Alabama, but was a strong pass rusher. A little undersized for a 4-3 DE, Williams may be a hybrid OLB/DE, or may find a home as a 3-4 OLB. Williams. Word is he struggled with different assignments in Alabama’s defense, but was most comfortable when just rushing the passer. Williams finished his Senior season with 31 tackles (22 solo), 16 TFL, 9 sacks, 2 passes defensed, and 2 FF’s. At the combine, Williams ran a 4.68 40, and chose not to participate in the bench press. Williams is a good player with talent, but where exactly he best fits will be up to the team that drafts him. I admit, if he were our pick at #22, I’d be disappointed, because I think he’d have to be more of a pass rush specialist, and not a starting DE, and IMO, that’s not a great value in the 1st RD. NFL.com has Williams rated at 6.04

Charles Harris 6’3” 253 DE Missouri

NCAA FOOTBALL: SEP 06 Missouri at Toledo

Harris is coming to play in the NFL after his Junior year at Missouri. Harris improved each year, and finished his Junior season with 61 tackles (35 solo), 12 TFL, 9 sacks,  2 passes defensed and 2 FF’s. Harris didn’t start playing football until his Junior year of HS, which is pretty late. Harris ran a 4.82 and put up 21 reps on the bench. He’s considered a good pass rusher, but not very strong against the run, and also has difficulty shedding blocks. NFL.com has Harris rated at 6.0

Takkarist McKinley 6’2” 250 DE UCLA


Takk is a very good athlete, and despite being a little short for a DE, he has long arms, and the speed and power to compete. Takk had his best year in college his final year at UCLA, where he put up 61 tackles, 18 TFL, 10 sacks, 6 passes defensed, and 3 FF’s. Great motor, and never stops. Takk recently had shoulder surgery, right before the combine, but he was able to particpate in all the drills, so I would imagine he’s going to be OK for the season. He’s another 3-4 OLB/4-3 DE prospect. Takk ran a 4.59 40 and put up 24 reps in the BP. He’s relatively raw as a pass rushing prospect, as evidenced by the jump from 3 sacks jis Junior year to 10 sacks in his Senior year. He will need to be taught, but the talent is there. NFL.com has Takk rated at 6.21

Carl Lawson 6’2” 261 DE Auburn


Lawson is a well built DE prospect. Very strong, putting up 35 reps on the BP. Pretty quick and athletic for his size too, running a 4.67 40 and and even more impressive 4.19 20 YD shuttle. Very good burst, and strong hands, 2 traits you look for in a DE. Lawson finished his Senior year with 30 tackles (16 solo), 14 TFL, 9.5 sacks and 1 FF. NFL.com has him rated at 5.75.

Jordan Willis 6’4” 255 DE Kansas State


Willis’ Head Coach Bill Snyder called Willis “The Epitome of Kansas State football”. Nuff said right there, that’s a pretty high compliment, especially from a Hall of Fame HC. Willis was Big 12 Player of the Year in 2016. Willis finished with 52 tackles (34 solo), 17,5 TFL, 11.5 sacks, 3 passes defensed, 3 FF’s and 1 FR. Pretty impressive. Willis has excellent speed, ran a 4.53 40, along with a DL best 39” vertical, which shows explosiveness, a 6.85 cone, and a 4.28 20 YD shuttle. Obviously, this kid is a great athlete. He also has a non stop motor, and always play to the whistle. Incidentally, the Dolphins have met with Willis a few times, according to our FU beat reporter D. NFL.com has Willis rated 5.72

Tanoh Kpassagnon 6’7” 289 DE Villanova


Excellent prototype size, with extraordinarily long arms (35 5/8”). Big enough to play either outside or inside. He does need to work on his lower body strength though. Very intelligent prospect, son of chemical scientist and economist. He currently has an internship with Price Waterhouse Coopers. Tanoh in his Senior season totaled 45 tackles (27 solo)along with 21.5 TFL, 11 sacks, 1 FF and 2 FR’s. He’s still a raw prospect, and needs to develop a repertoire of pass rushing moves. Definitely a player with upside, it seems scouts want to make sure he really loves football, as he appears to be on track in his business career. NFL.com compares him to Margus Hunt, and we know how that worked out. NFL.com has Tanoh rated at 5.59.

Next article will be a look at the LB’s, and then following that will be the safeties.

This entry was posted in Uncategorized. Bookmark the permalink.

549 Responses to 2017 NFL Draft – Defensive Ends

  1. CavalierKong says:

    Adios Fuckface. Thanks for nothing.

    • stangerx says:

      Unfortunately — dude was so screwed up that you almost don’t blame him. We passed that point like two years ago.

  2. Tim Knight says:

    Why are we worried about finding another Jones type safety right now? Most teams don’t have one as good as him. Talk about wanting it all. LOL

    • D says:

      I think you look for it, certainly, most arent going to have one, much less two like you said, but if you get a guy on a rookie contract that gives you close to Jones ability, then you are in a very good place. His rookie contract runs out about the same time as Jones comes up for a renewal, you have your guy to replace him and then you start the process over. Nothing wrong with drafting talent when you find it, even if there isnt a havy need, there will be some day. I mean people think of the Pats as smart with their drafts, but they took Garapolo in the 2nd, with Tom Brady on their team, did they need to take a QB in the 2nd? probably not, but there was talent there so they took it. They wind up getting Brady to play 6 more years like he says he will, then they have a guy who attracts a good trade value and they draft another guy and the cycle just continues.

      • D says:

        Or hell they dont even have to give you Jones like ability, this year, you have Allen you have your plan for the season, but you have a guy who might be Jones in a few years, or next year even. Its about keeping the cycle going, not about wait until ya gotta hit big with a player and draft them then, by then its too late because if he doesn’t pan out, you are properly fucked.

      • Tim Knight says:

        So DE, DT, LB, CB, S, G and TE? Bro, can’t do it all this year.

        These are not all needs, they are wants.

  3. Tim Knight says:

    Oy! The FS/SS thing again. How about interchangeable safeties who can play both? That’s how we play. 😉

    • D says:

      It really depends on the defensive scheme, a lot of teams play a CF with a run support SS, but thats really a thing of the past these days, you have to be able to run cover two with some teams, and you have to cover the middle zone on some, so you really need to have a hybrid. As with all things the DC can compensate, dont have a good middle zone guy, run cover two, by have your MLB slide back into the middle zone and use him as the shallow safety and make them throw in front of him in the shallow zone, or if you want to keep that shut down, have your LB’s go man on the slot and TE’s. Will leave you a little open for dump offs to the RB but you have solved your shallow safety deficiency. Dont have 2 good deep guys, play press zone with your CB’s and keep the WR’s from getting a chance to get deep.

      Teams cant count on having the best of everything so they either need hybrid players or they need to compensate with a good DC who can roll with what they have.

  4. Tim,
    I’m comparing the Culliver & McDonald situation because both weren’t expected to be available until later in the season and with Culliver it was the injury and McDonald is a completely different situation but I think McDonald ends up not even seeing the field with the team.

    By the time we get to game 9 I think he’s gone anyway.

  5. D says:

    Tim Knight says:
    March 31, 2017 at 5:44 pm

    So DE, DT, LB, CB, S, G and TE? Bro, can’t do it all this year.

    These are not all needs, they are wants.
    Did i say they were needs? Id say im saying exactly the opposite, im saying you take what the draft gives ya, but no moves up until this point say we WOULDNT take any position, except maybe WR or QB, in any round where the value matched it. There are a lot here that are saying well safety isnt one of them now, im just saying thats not at all accurate, not just because of a guy like McDonald signing the contract he did.

    • D says:

      And yes, all of those positions could be drafted, not all this year, and no one was saying we should try to, i was saying, (and if you argue this then you are a hypocrite because you have said this same thing many times) you keep adding talent through the draft every year, you dont go in saying we HAVE to have this position, unless you are in that position, this year for once we are not, we have some places we for sure need to get stronger, but when it comes to pick 22, we should be adding talent, if its a S, so be it, if its OG, so be it, whomever was the best guy on that board needs to be the guys whose name is called and TJ didnt change that for S.

    • steveccnv says:

      D, you’re all over the place, and not making much sense.

  6. You look up the definition of “wingnut” and there’s a picture of Jordan next to it.

    • D says:

      He has to be our biggest bust, i mean i still dont think he tops a Ryan Leaf, but he’s got to be our franchises top.

  7. D says:

    I didnt think we would be on different pages here Tim, find it odd you taking this stance over a nothing signing.

    Just to be certain, you are saying that because we signed TJ, that we would purposefully pass over a S prospect in any rounds before 5th, even if that guy was BPA?

  8. Tim Knight says:

    D, I’m not just making statements to you. Lot’s of people are saying stuff. 🙂

  9. Tim Knight says:

    D, you are replying to me about what others are saying and not reading what I have said. I don’t think safety is high on the list for our FO but if a guy is there they really love and they take him, I get it. I just don’t think safety is a high priority and it won’t happen. It’s an opinion, doesn’t mean mine is right and anyone else’s is wrong.

    I prefer post-draft when it’s what actually is as opposed to fantasy land that goes on pre-draft. LOL

    I have faith in this regime that they will add good players in this draft. I like this team and think we will be in the playoffs again already.

  10. D says:

    steveccnv says:
    March 31, 2017 at 6:02 pm

    D, you’re all over the place, and not making much sense.
    I dont think so i have been pretty consistent, the subject has changes and then changed agains and then changed for the sake of changing a third time.

    Original statement, S i whatever priority it was before, people on the board are at whatever place they were and TJ move didnt make a difference. That was the original question or maybe statement, was did that move meant S wasnt necessary. Only thing i have been trying to say, with several other here taking what im saying as something completely different, is that that move did nothing to our draft strategy nor importance of S in the draft.

      • D says:

        I don’t think so, i think have been pretty consistent. The subject has changed and then changed again, and then changed again, for the sake of changing a third time.

        Original statement, i made was S is whatever priority it was before. Team Big Board has the same people at whatever place they were, and the TJ move didn’t make a difference. That was in reply to the original question, or maybe statement, that the TJ move meant S was no longer necessary. Thats the only thing i have been trying to say, though several others here are taking what im saying, then replying as if i am saying something completely different.
        Sorry i think my typing is falling so far behind my thoughts that what has been coming out in type isn’t really readable. Sorry for that.

  11. D says:

    Steve i dont know what part makes no sense. I read it, and i might have had a run on a sentence or 4, but it makes sense to me! Just read what i meant lol. Shit you have read Piggys broken sentences for years, how can you not read between the lines on mine lol.

  12. CavalierKong says:

    A lot of talk about taking a flyer on a safety for the minimum. Gotta love the offseason.

  13. naplesfan2010 says:

    we just waived Dion Jordan.

  14. dbolt48 says:

    I just wanted to remind everyone that Dion Jordan blew himself up with a shop vac.

  15. Mike E. says:

    If only his real name was Dion Fuckface. Maybe Ireland wouldn’t have moved up to #3 to get him.

    • Brian in NY says:

      Fucking piece of shit. Both of them.

      • Mike E. says:

        Honestly, I blame Parcells. Fat POS was lazy as fuck in his planning , and assembled a hodge podge of never was’s and has been’s as our GM, HC, and assistant coaches. I can’t say Parcells ever cared about our team.

  16. Tim Knight says:

    Well Ireland is gone and so is his entire last draft class. Get out the Febreze and redecorate. LOL

  17. Rockphin says:

    Dion being cut ends the tenure of last player of what has to be the worse draft in franchise history.

    one first round pick, two 2nd round picks, two third round picks, two fourth and two 5th’s and one 7th. All now gone. Nothing left. SMH

    • stangerx says:

      I normally won’t call a guy bad pick if we don’t re-sign cause his number got too high……but only one that even might fall in that category is Sims. One horrible draft for sure.

  18. dbolt48 says:

    I blame DFF for me having no faith in bad decision makers maturing🤣

  19. stangerx says:

    Guess I’m going have to put something else up in the pool room. Anyone know if you have to repaint after removing a fathead?

    • steveccnv says:

      Unless you glued it in, it’s supposed to peal off.

      • stangerx says:

        Was joking (live in an apartment), but guessing those few who bought the Jordan model will find they got less than billed — one that will leave a serious stain. 🙂

  20. Brian in NY says:

    I know that we need defense, but I can’t help but thinking that Forrest Lamp should be the pick. Bushrod is signed, and Larsen could be used as a solid back up. It would be nice to have an OL that looks like : LT Tunsil , LG Lamp, C Pouncey, RG Bushrod, and RT James. I have a feeling that they are thinking about Larsen as the starter, and looking for a playmaker on D though with that first pick.

    • stangerx says:

      Lamp for sure makes the most sense as far as slotting him into the starting line-up on draft day. Don’t be surprised if the two go into a compete that Larsen wins over Bushrod though.

      • Brian in NY says:

        True. I’d just like to have a really good OL, with some solid backups so we don’t fall apart if one guy goes down.

      • stangerx says:

        There is no doubt there will be one or even two more OL guys in camp with a has at least “a chance to start” on them. Exactly how far we go with it depends on something none of us know — how they feel in Davie about Pouncey’s health.

    • steveccnv says:

      We cant get to the next level unless we have a better D, we can get to the next level with the current OGs. The team views OG as a non-primary position, so for them to draft it in the first would be out of character.

      • Tim Knight says:

        Agreed. I think it will be defense early and often.

      • Brian in NY says:

        You can’t definitively say that without first seeing them on the field. Tell that to Ryan Tannehill and Jay Ajayi. I think they would beg to differ.

      • stangerx says:

        Think for sure it will be defense often (but then thought that last year too), but not so sure that counts in definitely the 1st and even 2nd.

  21. sb7mvp says:

    Ask wake or Suh what side of the ball we should draft.

  22. Tim Knight says:

    Brian, you don’t have to go guard 1st rd to improve. I’m just saying I doubt we do, not that there is no chance.

  23. Tim Knight says:

    Was watching Rose and Bokamper on their show and Rose said people in the FO told him every defensive position is in play for the draft. That doesn’t mean we draft every one of them, but if BPA is there they’re all on the table.

  24. The more I watch Taco, the more I want Lamp in the 1st.

  25. The more I watch Taco, the more I want Dawuane Smoot.

  26. The more I watch Dawuane Smoot and Carroll Phillips, the more I want both & the more I think we’re not going to have a shot at them in the rounds I had us taking them in.

    • Tim Knight says:

      They are both 3-5 round guys right?

      • There’s scouts who think Phillips has 1st rd talent, however, I can’t see that happening but when you look at him and what else is available on defense he could definitely go in the 2nd rd.

        Smoot’s biggest issue is his lack of playing time because he played behind Jihad Ward in ’15 and wasn’t a full time starter until last season. Talent-wise he’s as good as anyone else in the 2nd rd. If he adds a little bit of size and strength with weights he’s got the possibility of being one of the best DE’s in this draft when we look back at it 3 yrs from now.

      • dbolt48 says:

        Phillips has explosion and ability to bend and flatten. Not ready to be a full time DE, but you give him 2yrs of development & strength training I think he’ll be a borderline pro bowl type player.

      • I’m not thinking of Phillips as a DE. I’d much rather him at SAM. I think he can close down plays on his side and then be used as a pass rusher on 3rd downs. Wouldn’t want him as a full time DE.

  27. Tim Knight says:

    Does anyone understand the cap space?

  28. Tim Knight says:

    If we stay where we are I could see our draft going something like this.
    1. DL
    2. CB
    3. LB
    5a. OG
    5b. DL
    5c. CB
    7. OG

    • Mike E. says:

      Where’s the safety and TE? This is bullshit! lol

      • Tim Knight says:


        We pretty much addressed it for this year. Fasano replaces Sims role, Thomas replaces Cameron, Gray is depth and Duarte needs to take the next step.

        Jones signed for 5 years, Allen, Thomas, Aikens, Hendy and McDonald for the 2nd half is not a pressing need anymore.

        But if a BPA falls then they are possibilities. 😉

      • steveccnv says:

        I already told you Mike no safety 😛

    • The Flying Pig says:

      How dare you wait u til the 3rd round to take a LB!

      Where are your Oinks!

      • Tim Knight says:

        4-3 LBs can be had later. It’s the top guys and edge guys who go first. But you can flip my order around if you wish. 🙂

      • The Flying Pig says:

        I’m just BB

        Generally I would like youth on D

  29. Tim Knight says:

    Thanks Lou. So the $9,995,089 is what’s left for UFAs and in-season moves which are always on the cheap side anyway?

    • give or take a little because, like I said, none of them are completely accurate. we saved some by restructuring Misi’s contract so that needs to be added back & then the McDonald contract isn’t in that figure yet. Even the NFLPA figures are off because all the contracts aren’t in those figures.

  30. stangerx says:

    Breaking: NFL will force Stephen Ross to sell the Miami Dolphins

    (anyone know today’s date?)


    • Mike E. says:

      Joke or not, I know OD got excited.

      • stangerx says:

        Yeah — OD sure don’t like Ross. You should hear some of his stories about his battles with Hugzienga and Robbie. I figure he is the voice for the guys who buy tickets. He’s helping us all out on that.

  31. The Flying Pig says:

    No more The Shining clips
    I want to sleep tonight

  32. The Flying Pig says:

    If we took CB in the 2nd
    Desmond King might be a nice pick
    I mean he is kind of a hybrid S/CB
    But he would be the big CB they like

    If you follow Tim’s positional selections

    1. McDowell/Barnett/Harris
    2. King
    3. Anthony walker?

    I think with those 3 5th rounders we might be able to move up in the 2nd or 3rd round
    Or even get into the 4th

    Everytime I do a lock there is a lot of talent left in the 4th
    Then it tails off a little

    • The Flying Pig says:

      I’m guess King being 5’10
      Doesn’t help this argument

      • Tim Knight says:

        He might be a good fit in nickel and dime which is a lot of the time. He doesn’t have to be one of the 4 starters, but a significant role player. Could push guys like Thomas and McCain. I can’t see us not drafting corners based on Gase’s comments.

      • someone needs to play the nickel or the dime because with Michael Thomas in there it’s been more like the penny.

  33. The Flying Pig says:

    54: R2P22
    97: R3P33
    166: R5P22
    178: R5P34
    184: R5P40
    223: R7P5

  34. My April 1st Jeff Ireland mock:

    22: R1P22
    54: R2P22
    97: R3P33
    166: R5P22
    178: R5P34
    184: R5P40
    223: R7P5

  35. steveccnv says:

    Adding McDonald to the cap does relatively nothing, because when you add him in you also have to remove the guy from the bottom, so adding in $775K (4-6 yr players) and taking away $465…

  36. Tim Knight says:

    One of the reasons to add DL now is that we have a vet room and it would be great to help teach young bucks how to work and be pros. All our main DL are in their 3rd season and more.

  37. steveccnv says:

    TJ McDonald says it’s Hammer Time (MC), the dude is big 6’2″ and 217 and lays the wood.

  38. steveccnv says:

    Impending free agent SS T.J. McDonald pleaded guilty to one misdemeanor count of reckless driving involving drugs or alcohol.
    McDonald was originally charged with driving under the influence of drugs after he was arrested last May, but he pleaded to a lesser offense. McDonald was sentenced to three years probation, ordered to complete a three-month alcohol program, and ordered to complete one-month residential drug program among other penalties. Likely to face a suspension now that the legal situation is resolved, McDonald could find a quieter than expected market in free agency.
    It’s not like he was coked out or on MJ or even drunk, but not sure if he has an addiction to pain killers. Wouldn’t be surprised if every NFL was addicted to them. He’s got a chance to make us really good in the back end late in the year, when we usually are banged up and falling apart. Would be a nice change from last year.

  39. steveccnv says:

    “T.J. McDonald, listed at 6-foot-2 and 217 pounds, is a hard-hitting safety who was ideal for the aggressive style of former Rams defensive coordinator Gregg Williams. Last season he also made some pretty drastic improvements in coverage. Pro Football Focus had him with an opponents’ QB rating of 68.8 while serving as the primary coverage defender, which was nearly half the QB rating he surrendered over the course of his first three seasons (121.6). McDonald played in every game last year and registered six defended passes. At 26, he was also a young free agent. He should provide the Dolphins with a major lift in their secondary for the second half.”


    Doesn’t sound like a nothing signing to me.

  40. The Flying Pig says:

    Malik McDowell has entered into one of my favorites for #22
    Over Mike E’s objection

    Jabril Peppers

    Those are pretty much favorites at 22 right now

  41. pheloniusphish says:

    Seats picked. Bring g o. The season!

  42. The Flying Pig says:

    There are probably some CBs out there that make good picks

    But I don’t know the CBs really well yet

  43. The Flying Pig says:

    Isn’t it weird that Lamp is basically the only guy on offense worth considering

    …maybe OJ Howard which is more BPA
    But pretty much it’s Lamp or defense in the 1st

  44. Tim Knight says:

    Gave it a shot and went BPA with need in mind. 😉
    22: R1P22
    54: R2P22
    97: R3P33
    166: R5P22
    178: R5P34
    184: R5P40
    223: R7P5

  45. Dolphins are hosting prospect Michael Flatuencia from Shiton U.

  46. Tim Knight says:

    I think we forget that early on some other positions are going to go as well so someone has to fall to us. LOL

  47. son of a son of a shula says:

    I don’t think I’d take Lamp first. I generally accessorize at the end.

  48. Tim Knight says:

    When more than half your draft starts from #166 on you can’t get that picky. 🙂

    That’s why I wouldn’t be surprised if we turned our draft into 4-5 from 7 picks being able to trade comp picks now. You can get UDFAs who are in the same boat as 6th and 7th rd picks. Every draft gets watered down at some point and you just take the BPA/need when you can.

  49. Why doesn’t anyone have a concern about TJ Watt only playing defense one year as a starter and having knee surgery on his right knee that caused him to miss ’14 and then injured his left knee before ’15 that limited his play then?

    The red flags should be flying all over the place on this one.

    • Tim Knight says:

      I like his skill-set though. 2nd rd for him makes sense, 1st rd you better be right.

      There’s your Mis replacement Sam LB and edge guy at times.

  50. Tim Knight says:

    Brian, getting better as a team and winning games is more important than a 3rd and 4th rd pick for a guy who helps solidify the WR corps in his 2nd year. We had to use at least a future 3rd to land him, we didn’t have another 3rd – ours went for Drake. The 4th was the additional compensation. Oh right and a 6th which we also had two of last year. The only minus is a 4th. You have to use a pick to draft the guy. It was MIN’s 3rd that they gave away for this year. They traded it for a 2016 6th and a 2017 3rd and 4th. The 3rd’s are swaps and strangely enough both at #22. 🙂

    If Carroo becomes a solid addition at WR it’s all good. Landry, Stills and Parker and now with Thomas at TE could be lethal. Ajayi has already put teams on notice, better stop me first. 🙂

    • You have to wonder what they were thinking with the pick. Is the philosophy that they’re taking the highest rated guy on the board regardless of need? They said they had a 2nd rd grade on him.

      So was the thinking “hey, Carroo is the highest rated guy there, we should go get him before somone else does?”

      • Tim Knight says:

        Yes, for an additional 4th at the end of the day. Oh the horror! I don’t get the panic about it. He was traded for a 3rd we never had, not an additional 3rd.

    • That’s what it looks like to me. Carroo was the highest-rated player on their board and although they had needs elsewhere they weren’t going to take a player just to fill a hole if that player wasn’t rated nearly as high as Carroo was.

      Someone has been pointing out that type of scenario on here about the 1st rd this year.

      • stangerx says:

        They moved strongly up and into the future for him. Clearly they liked him, but not like they had too.

  51. stangerx says:

    Carroo might end up in the HOF, but next year he will be a 4th wideout who barely hit the field last season behind a real solid top three (and all young ones too). And we just signed Stills for years.

    Call me crazy, but I at least would right now trade him back for what we gave up for him.

    • Tim Knight says:

      If any of our WRs goes down he’s next up. Why keep subtracting for unknowns?

      • stangerx says:

        Sorta how it works with a 4th wideout. Maybe I just value that spot less highly than you do. But then I don’t know enough about him to judge since he hasn’t played. Could be they will not re-sign Landry cause they have him or are planning to trade Parker. Just don’t see his possible role as worth what we paid for him as we type.

  52. Tim Knight says:

    The bulk of our players knowing the team mind scheme in year 2 is huge, bigger than the draft to me. That’s icing on the cake. Gase is building a winning mentality. He knows what it looks like.

    • I was one of the few who really liked the pick. yeah, he’s kind of buried on the depth chart but I’ve been saying for years that it doesn’t matter where you upgrade, its the fact that you’re doing it.

      We could have taken a lesser player at another position and what would that have done for us? It starts that same cycle all over again. If Carroo balls then maybe he or one of our other guys gives us the ability to make a trade that will more than recoup what we gave up for Carroo in the draft.

      Maybe we get picks or maybe we get a player at a position where we need help or a combination of the two but we’re not going to get anything like that if we keep taking lesser talent just to fill a need. We’ve seen over the past few years we just keep cutting those types of guys.

  53. So, I go back and look at what they did to get Carroo and, like I said, it makes me think they’re sitting there saying, “we’re sticking with our board. wr isn’t our greatest need but we don’t have a player on our board right now who’s anywhere near close to being rated as high as we’ve got Carroo” and they didn’t value the players they could have drafted with those other picks as much so they used them to go get him.

    So, now, I’m sitting here thinking to myself that after all the talk about Lamp and DE’s and LB’s, what if we get to #22 and the highest rated player on their board is McCaffrey? You just never know.

    • Tim Knight says:

      McCaffrey is such a Pats type player isn’t he? He can line up as a WR too. Don’t be surprised if they they trade up for him and get a dual threat in their system. They just won the SB and seem to be okay where they are. He makes them better. Ugh!

      • steveccnv says:

        Cheats don’t pick until the 3rd I think, so they’d have to use next year’s picks, but I wouldn’t put it past them, they seem to be loading up for the end of Brady.

  54. Tim Knight says:

    It’s about having 4 WRs they like. Not moving this guy and replace that guy. Geez! Everyone talks about depth then wants to move on from it. What’s the point of the draft then?

    • I just go back and look at all the past draft where we drafted for need. Traded down to get Odrick then took Misi in the 2nd. Odrick has no home right now and we couldn’t give Misi away.

      Then there’s Taylor and Davis because we needed cb’s. These are just a few examples. There’s others as well when you look at our draft history just going back to 2010.

      We’ve drafted for need plenty of times & look at what we’ve got remaining on the roster from those drafts.

  55. steveccnv says:

    Damn I agreed with the last 2 Lou posts😀

  56. steveccnv says:

    When you trade next year’s picks they count like one round later, so according to the value chart we actually won the Carroo trade, and that was counting us with the same pick as last year, not 22 in the round.

  57. steveccnv says:

    Carroo was a steal last year, based on what they thought of him. He’s like Matthew’s, but more talented, and more talented than Landry, but Landry’S best quality isn’t his talent.

  58. steveccnv says:

    I expect to see Carroo in the game in 4 WR sets, so imagine our 4th CB trying to cover him, and that’s what he’ll have to beat.

  59. steveccnv says:

    You can have all the talent in the world, but if you don’t use it right what good is it. I think Gase knows how to use it.

  60. The Flying Pig says:

    Dolphins looking at Justin Evans

  61. The Flying Pig says:

    Long term developmental project to play alongside Reshad

  62. manitobafinfan says:

    Piggy , i am glad the Shining pics disturb you, cause that pic from Clockwork with the eye balls and needles makes me cringe and close MY eyes everytime i see it…

  63. manitobafinfan says:

    Back from 🇯🇲And Spring is HERE !!!! Woohoo.

  64. manitobafinfan says:

    Very happy with FO off-season moves so far, would like to have the Zac Brown Band touring with our Berserkers.. but if not cest la vie…

    As far as TJ signing, i like it as a Cost nothing addition, if he gets straight and buys in great , he is a very physical player, there is a chance to sign him longterm at years end if need be.. if not cut him and ni hangover.

  65. manitobafinfan says:

    Allow me carry on talking to myself 😎

    Forgot how many great tunes Bob Seger had..

    Few years back wife bought me a digital Turntable as i own over 700 albums and could now upload a bunch of stuff off them.. finally have the space to leave it set up permanently, so today started to add a couple Seger tunes, and ended up with almost three full albums worth.

    Top 2 all time are Turn the Page and Famous Final Scene , his Sax player rivals Big Clarence ….

  66. manitobafinfan says:

    Also must say Shout out to Mike E and Wedge for the Player articles, and to D, Professor, DBolt and everyone else for discussing the players so us College Ignorant people know who and what is out there… thanks to all.
    Lets hope our CFL signee plays 1/2 as good as Wake has and we may be better set up on D than we realize.

    Go PHINS 👍👍

  67. manitobafinfan says:

    KBi,m dine. Carry on 😎😎

  68. The Flying Pig says:

    I do think, like Barry Jackson said, it would be a good idea to draft a safety to develop

    And that is where Justin Evans might come in

  69. steveccnv says:

    We still need to look at safety, but we don’t need one this year as much as other positions. Do your due diligence and check out the guys out there, and if you feel the BPA value is there you select one. Same thing they did with Carroo, he was insurance in case Stills didn’t resign, we didn’t need him, but they liked the value so much they traded up. We’re in the 2nd round on the clock and there’s a safety there that you’ve graded much higher than DE/DT/CB/OG and you decide to take him instead of reaching for another position of higher need, and that’s fine, we’ve seen enough of Ireland and Wanny reach for guys in the past.

    • steveccnv says:

      I still might not even draft the safety, because I think there’s no need to get one this year, I’d wait and see how TJ meshes with Jones first.

  70. steveccnv says:

    You guys will say, we should draft a developmental type of safety, but we did that last year with Lucas and have Thomas and Aikens for that.

  71. manitobafinfan says:

    Steve , i agree OG is our most pressing need without reaching , play the grades and draft BPA keeping in mind positions of need as well.. if an absolute STUD falls to us outside of round 1 at a non essential Need Position even QB or WR go for it. Hopefully the falling stud IS a weaker position though

    • manitobafinfan says:

      If the grading is even close though , position of need should prevail

    • steveccnv says:

      OG depending on how you feel about Larsen, compared to Allen and Misi. I don’t know enough about Larsen, but I do know our FO doesn’t value OG enough to take one in the first.

  72. Tim Knight says:

    Don’t forget developmental players already on the team. Most of them will be more important than most of this draft class.

    • manitobafinfan says:

      Tim , would you feel we have more developmentals at S or OL ?? Id lean toward more of them at safety … making OL more needy, not that those are only positions in play

      • steveccnv says:

        We need to rid ourselves of the developmental scrubs, guys like Aikens (I know STs), but still…

      • I’m a believer that the bottom of the roster could be churned every year with new draft picks and udfa’s. There’s plenty of talent out there and I agree that there’s some guys on the team like Aikens and Thomas, for instance, who could be replaced.

        Aikens has done well for us on st’s but really hasn’t done anything to earn playing time as a safety. When Isa goes down, instead of Aikens or Thomas getting the nod, we go out and bring in a guy off the street, literally. So what’s the value of either of these guys?

        You can always find guys on special teams. You need quality depth too. Churn the bottom of the roster

  73. Mike E. says:


    Did we not just bring in Ted Larsen and also re-sign Jermon Bushrod? No need for an OG.

    See what I did there? 🙂

    • steveccnv says:

      Yes, but neither is a stud, TJ is a stud, making OL more of a need/upgrade needed than safety. We don’t have a glaring need for starters, but since our 3rd DT will play a lot, that may be our biggest need, then OL, DE, CB…

      • Mike E. says:

        Steve, he’s talented, but he was just suspended for drugs, no? He’s a risk, whether it’s a talent risk, or personality risk, still a risk.

  74. Mike E. says:

    Hey Toba! What up Dougie Fresh?

  75. steveccnv says:
    April 1, 2017 at 11:30 pm
    OG depending on how you feel about Larsen, compared to Allen and Misi. I don’t know enough about Larsen, but I do know our FO doesn’t value OG enough to take one in the first.

    I’d like to think they’d take someone like Lamp in the first but I tend to agree they’re not valuing the guard position that highly. The earliest they’re probably going to take one is the 2nd and maybe even the 3rd rd.

    Feeney, Dawkins, Johnson, Elflien, Asiata are all guys who could possibly be had 2nd or 3rd rd and that’s the way it may work out.

    I also strongly believe they believe in their board and they are going to take the highest rated player they’ve got regardless of what the glaring need seems to be. With what they’ve done with re-signing Branch and bringing in Hayes on the d-line I think they feel good about where they’re at. At LB I think they feel good with Timmons and re-signing Misi and having a guy like Hewitt there as well. Same goes for the offensive line with Bushrod and Larsen and dback with Allen and McDonald being signed.

    So, like others have said to me before, they are going into the draft looking at the situation as though they don’t really NEED to draft a player at any one particular position but, rather, just take guys who will increase the overall level of talent on the team and if it so happens to fill a void somewhere then all the better.

    • steveccnv says:

      True that, which I’ve mentioned several times, but once the draft starts there’s going to be guys on our board that fall and we’re going to trade up to get, much to the dismay of most of FU. I have no problem trading up to get someone you really like, it’s better than just taking the shit that is there when you’re on the clock.

      • steveccnv says:

        Which was the logic they used with the Carroo trade up. You give up fair compensation to your trade partner, so you gain nothing there, but you get value from where you have the draftee graded. Then you trade down, when you don’t like the value, from your board, when you’re on the clock, if you can.

      • If they stick with this philosophy I can’t argue with it. Instead of sitting here day after day combing over the prospects I’m just going to sit back from now on and just observe.

        Can’t wait until the draft now to see what they do. Don’t care about the positions. I just want the best guys out there.

      • steveccnv says:

        So how did you feel about the Carroo trade up?

  76. The Patriots typically only have about 15 players with 1st rd grades on them so if they were sitting at #22 they’d drop out of the 1st altogether.

  77. Mike E. says:

    I like Dawkins a lot. I’d be very happy with him in the 2nd

    • steveccnv says:

      I’d rather go Pocic/Elflein in the 2nd, but based on Dawkins scouting report he seems ok, haven’t looked at him yet.

      • Mike E. says:

        Plays real mean and nasty. Pat Kirwan was interviewing him, and Kirwan, who watched a lot of his film asked Dawkins if he was ever on the ground this season. He said once, other than tripping, but he was only knocked to the ground once. He’s a tough customer who has played a lot of tackle and guard. I think he’d be great for us.

  78. olddolphan says:

    Mike E: USUALLY OUTSTANDING ANALYSIS!!! – – I second Young Stanger’s comments on this article.
    QUESTION: Did you have a chance to take a close look at Florida Atlantic’s Trey Hendrickson, DE, who was last season’s Defensive Player of the Year in Conference USA?? I’ve seen him rated anywhere between a 3rd and 5th round pick. Trey is FAU’s all-time sack leader and, if available in the middle rounds, might get some interest from the Fins. He would be the FIRST FAU PLAYER ever drafted by Miami.
    ALSO , I do not agree that adding Larsen and resigning Bushrod means we don’t need another guard. Both have failed to impress me (although I HOPE both of them will). We still have AT LEAST ONE HOLE TO FILL in our O-Line, and that assumes Pouncey plays all 16 games, which I would bet against.
    AGAIN, thanks for the terrific article.

    • stangerx says:

      Good to see you OD. And could not agree more about getting another G…..my best guess is that out of Larsen and Bushrod — one will be starting and the other will be the next man in.

      Not sure if I would call either of them a hole, but it is the clearest place to upgrade. Actually feels pretty good to be able to say that versus past years at this time.

  79. The Flying Pig says:

    Josh Jones is the other safety we recently brought in

  80. Mike E. says:

    Thanks OD – I don’t think we’re OK at OG either. It was a joke to Steve.

    • steveccnv says:

      I think everyone wants an upgrade at OG, but if we have to go into the season status quo we’ll get by, just like both SB teams did last year, it’s not a position you have to have a stud at. Unless we take an OG in the first the chances are he isn’t going to start this year anyways, so better get used to the thought of Larsen and Bushrod as the starting guards.

      • olddolphan says:

        I DON’T THINK “we’ll get by.” I think our running game will take a big hit AND our QB will be in extreme jeopardy. If we start the season with Larsen & Bushrod as our starters for 16 games we’ll be lucky to go 9-7 (and probably WON’T go 9-7). Want to bet me on that, Steve?

      • steveccnv says:

        Lots of other factors will go into us going 9-7 or higher, not many of which are related to who plays OG, so no.

  81. stangerx says:

    Maybe am hitting the koolaid — but even turning pure roster think we are a better team right now than were last year on opening day. And in that am even including moves that did not work out in the season like Mario Williams and Cameron.

    That is before whoever else comes on in the draft or as FAs.

    • steveccnv says:

      I agree, plus Gase knows what he wants to do now, as opposed to the way he coached the first 5 games last year, when we were the worst team in the NFL, even Clev. should’ve beaten us and would’ve had it not been for a missed FG to end regulation. Timmons and Thomas are huge acquisitions for me, Larsen and Allen are stopgaps.

      • Tim Knight says:

        We forget that we put CLE away in that game and somehow let them back in. It was as if we thought the game was over too early.

      • steveccnv says:

        Tim has his quota of writing forget for the day 😛

      • stangerx says:

        Cleveland is what the down side on it. Still feel we got lucky last year in so many games against bad teams and the schedule will be tougher this year. Maybe Gase has a way of winning the close ones like the great ones do, or maybe we end up 8-8 or 9-7 and miss the playoffs with an actually better team.

      • steveccnv says:

        Why will the schedule be tougher this year? Yeah we play 2 games against 2nd place teams instead of 4th place, but they said our schedule last year was much tougher than the one the year before and didn’t turn out that way. One thing about the schedule that will piss me off is playing again on the road on Thursday for like the 4th time in 5 years, when the cheats haven’t played more than one road Thursday game in the last 7 years. Thursday road games are the biggest disadvantage of all the games.

      • stangerx says:

        Who know how it turns out in the season, but AFC West and NFC South are not exactly the divisions you want to line up against.

      • steveccnv says:

        Again that’s what they said last year about the NFC West and the AFC North.

  82. steveccnv says:

    Mike, I’m in on Dawkins, he reminds me of Joe Jacoby from the 90’s hogs.

    My updated draft wish list, 1) Malik McDowell 2) Dion Dawkins 3) haven’t looked at LB enough yet, but that will go here. The rest I don’t really care yet, just want BPA.

    • steveccnv says:

      That’s Dawkins #66, they don’t show where’s he’s at on this tape.

    • steveccnv says:

      Make that edge and not LB in the 3rd, Misi will start over any LB we take in the 3rd or lower. Don’t really like the thought of taking an OLB high, when he may not stay on the field too long (sub packages).

      • steveccnv says:

        I want to like Tanoh Kpassagnon, because I want a tall DE to make those quick throws Brady likes harder, but this guy is too raw and not fast enough.

  83. Tim Knight says:

    LOL @ Steve

    The CLE game pissed me off. I think the team learned a lot from it though.

    • stangerx says:

      Tim — I was at the top of the section and ready to run to my car, thinking that this is end of the season. Then they blew the easy field goal and went back to the seat. No playoffs last year without that miss.

    • steveccnv says:

      Watching that game I was thinking, OMG we suck, we’re the worst team in the league. The power polls after that game had us around 30.

  84. steveccnv says:

    So far I like Smoot as our edge rusher to take in the 3rd, but hard to judge a guy from watching him play against a small school.

    • steveccnv says:

      Smoot holds his own against Michigan, doesn’t do anything great, but is solid. After watching highlights he looks great, the reality is he’s physical, has quickness, and doesn’t get out of position too often.

      22 malik mcDowell, 54 Dion Dawkins, and 97 Dawuane smoot. this is D perfect Draft for us.

  85. steveccnv says:

    OD, I watch your boy Trey Hendrickson, but he’s a poorman’s Rob Ninkovich. I liked him better than some guys rated higher, but he’s more energy, than talent, I think he’s already peaked.

  86. steveccnv says:

    OD, I’ve got us taking Dion Dawkins from Temple in the second. I never said we shouldn’t take an OG, I said, if we don’t we’ll be ok, and don’t take one in the first. We got by last year with guys worse than what we’re projecting to start this year, and we had a Pro Bowl RB, sure we had a lot of 3 and outs, but the problem wasn’t the OL. Take a look at him dominating State Penn.

  87. Tim Knight says:

    I think the 2nd rd would be a good time for a guard, but I also seeing it being good for a CB.

  88. stangerx says:

    Part of the recent team moves is that they actually might help us get more Phin fans at home games down the road, even if maybe at the expense of local tourism.

    Miami, NYC, and New Orleans have been top away game destinations for fans planning a trip, but now Vegas and LA (times two) will be there as options as well.

  89. Rockphin says:

    sb7mvp says:
    March 30, 2017 at 7:54 am

    I am groot


  90. Tim Knight says:

    Zach Brown will be visiting the Redskins next.

  91. Tim Knight says:

    About Carroo and other notes about the offense. I watched video of Gase discuss this at the coaches meetings but in case some of didn’t here you go.

    • Mike E. says:

      Hopefully that role is on the FIELD, and not on the BENCH!

      • Tim Knight says:

        I think we see a different offense this year. Not system, but approach. Gase learned a lot about this team and being a HC including mistakes he admits he made last year.

    • stangerx says:

      “We need to lean on his strengths more, which I don’t think I did a very good job with last year. I have a better idea of, how we do want to use him this year going forward? If something were to happen with one of those guys outside, we definitely know how we want to use him to his strengths…..You have a guy that’s smart, an extremely hard worker and he does have a desire to be a guy that ends up starting for us at some point in his career. That’s a tough lineup to crack.”

      To me that is coach-speak for working on it with him. Interesting that he talked outside guy though. Might be to Landry’s agent as well.

      • Tim Knight says:

        Gase is frank when he speaks. He doesn’t BS.

      • stangerx says:

        Completely agreed. One of the things I really like about him. Take him at his word. He’s also a real nice guy, and that includes him taking some of it on himself.

      • steveccnv says:

        Gase can do those things, because he’s not insecure, like…

  92. Tim Knight says:

    Not that CBS NDS is the book on where prospects will go, but it looks like about 8 OLBs could go 1st and 2nd rd and only about 3 ILB. The fact that there are 11 or so LBs ranked that high, there’s a good chance a couple fall later as well. Other positions will be drafted pushing some good talent at multiple positions for us at #97 in the 3rd and that’s why I think we can get a LB here.

    • steveccnv says:

      If you’re taking an LB in the 3rd, which position are you not taking top 3 (DT,DE,OG)?

      • Tim Knight says:

        I posted yesterday DL, CB, LB. We target guards later and probably sign another vet for the open competition. I believe the team thinks higher of Bushrod and Larsen than others do. But there will be competition.

        Guards in our offense don’t have to be dominant. They need to be athletic though.

  93. Tim Knight says:

    Stanger, there’s a reason Peyton loved him. 😉

  94. manitobafinfan says:

    Gronk in the ring at Wrestlemania. Hope he broke his frikking shoulder.

  95. manitobafinfan says:

    Mike E. thanks . Yes i am a lot more chilled out, was much needed.

  96. naplesfan2010 says:

    I like DT Dalvin Tomlinson in the second …hoping he drops to us there. Just his picture is frightening. He is very smart and intrinsically motivated. Just the perfect Gase type guy.
    We really need another quality DT for our rotation.
    I want Haason Reddick in the first.

    • steveccnv says:

      I think he’s a product of the great players around him, but he had 1 sack and 2 other tackles, got very little push the entire game against a weak W. Kentucky team.

      • steveccnv says:

        Against Wisconsin he had 2 batted balls, at least he knew he couldn’t get any push and played for the batted ball, and very little else. He seems to be the last lineman to the QB on every play.

  97. manitobafinfan says:

    I will be happy for a Starter anywhere with RD 1 pick

  98. olddolphan says:

    SO STEVE, I see where you think “We’ll be OK with Larsen and Bushrod as our starting Guards” but you WON’T bet we’ll go at least 9-7 if they start. WELL I guess that means 8-8 or worse, so I’d have to say I’m underwhelmed with both your logic and your intestinal fortitude.

    Yes,Steve, “other factors” could cause a lousy season for Miami. Ajayi COULD suck. Tannehill COULD have a lousier season. The wideouts could be unproductive. And the defense could be on the field way too long and, in the end, get worn down. But the TRUTH IS, if some/most of those “other factors” do occur, THE FAULT WILL LIE IN THE FACT THAT LARSEN & BUSHROD were not good enough, and, perhaps, POUNCEY did as expected, play only PART of the season before having to be replaced. IF MIAMI selects a starting quality O-Lineman in the first two rounds, it’s highly likely his starting job will come at the “cost” of either Larsen or Bushrod starting game one. THAT, to me, will be a huge plus. HOW HUGE?? it will be the difference between a non-winning season and contention for a playoff spot! And you can quote me on that!

    Man-up, Steve.

    • steveccnv says:

      I got your intestinal fortitude right here pal. Funny how Gase said Bushrod was our 2nd best OL last year and he played all 17 games. I said we’ll be ok with those 2 starting, but of course we should try to upgrade I just don’t like taking an OG, nor does the team, with #22. Maybe you didn’t see where I have us taking Dion Dawkins in the 2nd, I also said I wouldn’t complain with Lamp at #22, but I don’t want him there.

    • olddolphan says:

      I read your posts and was NOT impressed at all, Steve. And as far as you shutting what you call my “fucking mouth”, your’e only displaying your childish behavior and your lack of fortitude. Take your own advice and read some of MY older posts. They include my exact seat numbers at the stadium if you REALLY want to try to shut my mouth! I don’t think you’ve got the balls to do it.

      You’re a total fraud, Steve. Good ight and good luck.

      • steveccnv says:

        From the guy that still worry’s about Ross like a 2 year old can’t get over something. I read your posts all you do is bitch about one thing or the other or talk about FAU that no one cares about.

  99. olddolphan says:

    MANITOBA: I’ve worn your Winnipeg Jets cap twice in the last 2 weeks and they won both times!!–Plan on donning it again for their next game. –Good to see you on the board!

    • manitobafinfan says:

      Thanks OD ya took too long to start wearing it though, they aint making playoffs … hope The Lightning do.

    • steveccnv says:

      Just another kiss ass OD post.

      • olddolphan says:

        THANKS, again, for proving my point, Steve. See you at the stadium.

      • steveccnv says:

        You have no point, you never have. You post here like you’re on Twitter, got up took a shit, have to be in Baltimore this week, don’t get a day off for 3 more weeks.

      • steveccnv says:

        I can’t think of one of your posts that brought anything to this board. Bitch about one thing or another, never a thought or idea how to fix anything, or who to draft.

  100. naplesfan2010 says:

    I think this is a year we really have set ourselves up for drafting a superstar BPA.

    Our only real remaining need is at DT where we really do have a significant hole.

    We seem to have set our eyes on certain guys in FA, TWO TEs, TWO Safeties, a DE (runstopper), a MLB (runstopper/interceptor), and a starting quick guard LG (pulling guard).

    In addition, we re-signed our deep-speed WR, our playmaking OLB, our pass-rush DEs, our LS, and cut or let walk a lot of dead wood.

    The only loss worth mentioning was Dion Sims, but that was a little like losing Rishard Mathews. Yeah it hurts, but it isn’t insurmountable and couldn’t be helped.

Leave a Reply

Please log in using one of these methods to post your comment:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s